I know, right? I guess Bernie is a shill for unions and tech companies!

https://www.opensecrets.org/politicians/contrib.php?cycle=Career&cid=n00000528

So what you're trying to say...is that you shouldn't be allowed to hold a political opinion if anyone from that industry donates to your campaign?..

...are you remotely aware of how delusional that is?



He's a Clinton shill now

This post was edited by EndlessSky on Aug 17 2016 11:31pm

Do you think the information is valid or false?



That is not my claim. I'm not saying he should or shouldn't be allowed to hold that opinion. What I'm saying is that he has spread misleading information about cigarette smoking in order to receive campaign donations from the tobacco industry. Make of that what you will.



Bernie definitely is a shill for unions.



Is your definition of a shill someone who votes for that candidate? I have criticized Hillary on multiple issues for multiple reasons, including her shilling out to various industries and countries.

I think you have a misunderstanding of what a shill is. Also, I do not think you are capable of criticizing the candidate, the running mate, or the campaign of the person you are voting for like I am.

This post was edited by ThatAlex on Aug 17 2016 11:41pm

Holy fucking ball-crushing irony.

"This hurts my feelings and I don't recognize the source, better attack that instead of using my big boy words."

I am just wondering where you are getting the information from. I think it is likely valid.

It's always good to question the validity of sources. But I think the claims are valid.

https://www.industrydocumentslibrary.ucsf.edu/tobacco/docs/#id=gggd0188

http://www.opensecrets.org/politicians/contrib.php?cycle=Career&type=I&cid=N00003765&newMem=N&recs=20

http://www.nacsonline.com/advocacy/Issues/Tobacco/Pages/default.aspx

http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2009/roll335.xml

http://www.followthemoney.org/show-me?f-core=1&c-t-eid=10245969&d-cci=143#[%7B1|%7B1|gro=d-id

https://thinkprogress.org/mike-pence-cigarette-truther-4b89e9304759#.1cb6669zp

http://fortune.com/2016/07/15/mike-pence-donald-trump-science/

Do you have proof that he changed his position due to money? If not, he isn't saying this stuff for "campaign donations." Perhaps the tobacco companies finally found someone who represents their views and so they donate in order to have a voice in government. How is it any different than you donating to someone who represents your views?

I don't think Pence actually thinks smoking doesn't kill. Remember, he said this:

"Despite the hysteria from the political class and the media, smoking doesn't kill."

Do you honestly think that represents his view on the subject? If so, it seems like you are going with option 2 of my OP on this subject, that Pence doesn't acknowledge that the scientific and medical community has overwhelmingly cited the negative effects that smoking has on health.

This post was edited by ThatAlex on Aug 18 2016 12:51am

Correlation != Causation

Saying that smoking kills is akin to saying vaccines cause autism.

Correlation is indeed not causation, but smoking is highly associated with lung-related illnesses, a vast array of cardiovascular health problems, and death. The scientific research and statistics on this subject are quite robust.

Are you familiar with the concept of relative risk? There is a strong relationship between smoking and negative health outcomes such as lung cancer and emphysema.



Holy shit.