Quote (Black XistenZ @ Sep 2 2024 02:49pm)

Agreed. I think I've written about this before, but this is all part of China's long-term strategy and our greedy corporations fell for it like flies in a Venus flytrap...

1. China becomes a booming growth market.
2. Western car companies make an increasing share of their overall revenue and profits in the Chinese market.
3. The rise of China coupled with the stagnation of the West goads Western car companies into a critical dependency on the Chinese market, pulling out of it is no longer possible.
4. China imposes regulations, ostensibly due to pollution concerns, which effectively force a phasing out or ICE cars with a deadline in the late 2010s/early 2020s.
5. Since they critically rely on the Chinese market and a dual track R&D is too expensive, most Western car makers have no other choice than to give up on fossil cars and take part in the EV craze.
6. This transition to electric mobility devalues the century-old technological know-how on which the business model of the Western car makers, as well as significant chunks of the wealth of their nations, was based.
7. With the technological playing field leveled, the Chinese car manufacturers can leverage their cost advantages (cheap labor and energy, lower bureaucracy, short supply lines) to outcompete their Western rivals in the new EV market. First in China itself, then also in the Western markets.


Tariffs can slow down or perhaps even stop the last step, but the Chinese market is lost for Western car makers, which is a huge problem for them in and off itself. And most of the Western governments, think tanks, media and institutions are thoroughly infested with the climate agenda and will thus push for the electrification of individual mobility. How long will they be able to keep up high tariffs on cheap Chinese models while the domestic models are unaffordable for lower-income folks and old fossil cars are increasingly banned via sneaky regulations?

Quote (ofthevoid @ 2 Sep 2024 21:35)

Interesting. I haven't heard that theory before but it's possible. One advantage from a geopolitical perspective that China has over the west is their ability to think longer term and plan accordingly. A plan like the one you highlight would take many years to play out, something we in the west arent that good at (democracies are inherently unstable, and it's hard to achieve multi-decade shifts and missions such as that one because there's too much political change)

I generally agree tariffs are regressive but currently there's no real alternative. Democrats and a lot of economists are piling on Trump for proposing tariffs, but they don't provide working alternatives. In the long term do we just let China put our steel, car, solar panels, whatever other 'real' productive capacity we have out of business permanently or do we insulate through protectionism? IMO the latter is the lesser of the two evils.

Quote (Black XistenZ @ Sep 2 2024 06:22pm)

There is none. The Greens and the Social Democrats are beholden to the "green transformation" and thus have no intentions of bringing down energy prices to an internationally competitive level any time soon. The mainstream "conservative" CDU keeps refusing to coalesce with the right-wing populist AfD and therefore has no power options besides these two parties, so that a proper change of course is not realistic. Merkel and the MSM have maneuvered German politics into a destructive dead end.

Regarding VW, a couple of additional factors must be kept in mind, though. For one, the main problem of the Volkswagen Group is with their core brand VW whose margins have gotten dangerously low. Other brands within the conglomerate, for example Skoda, Seat, Audi and Porsche, are faring better. Many of their mistakes are coming home to roost now. Dieselgate/the cheating software. Their abandonment of cheap, entry-level cars in favor of midmarket limousines and ever-growing SUVs. They should have either rejected the transition to EVs, or transitioned to them much quicker than they did. They bet too heavily on the Chinese market while neglecting others, which bites them in the ass, now that the Chinese economy is in the mud.

More globally speaking, they're suffering from difficult market conditions: the high interest rates and the cost of living crisis since 2021/22 have caused sluggish car markets around the globe. Other car manufacturers like Ford are also closing plants due to the difficult market, see for example here: https://www.fordcountychronicle.com/articles/featured/plant-to-close-due-to-difficult-market-conditions-says-firm/

Quote (JohnnyMcCoy @ 3 Sep 2024 22:14)

corporate germany deserves this, these companies have been money printers for decades and destroyed everything on a whim to appease climate change fanatics, dipshit politicians and leftie media outlets

they support unrestricted mass migration, used the eurozone to turn germany into a low wage sweatshop for highly skilled workers for max profit and max taxes for the state

meanwhile germans are among the poorest people in europe

well deserved, let it burn

Quote (Black XistenZ @ 3 Sep 2024 22:33)

1000% this.

It should also be noted that the Volkswagen Group had posted record revenue and profits just last year, so it's not like they're posting huge losses and thus desperately need to close factories and release workers to survive.... they're simply not meeting their profitability targets anymore amidst a difficult market environment and due to past mistake of corporate leadership, and now want to squeeze their workers and the public purse some more. Nothing more, nothing less.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/272053/operating-profit-of-volkswagen-since-2006/
https://www.statista.com/statistics/264349/sales-revenue-of-volkswagen-ag-since-2006/

Quote (ChatGPT)

Here's a table listing Volkswagen factories and the countries where they are located:

| **Factory Location** | **Country** |
|---------------------------------------|-------------------------|
| Wolfsburg | Germany |
| Emden | Germany |
| Hanover | Germany |
| Zwickau | Germany |
| Dresden | Germany |
| Kassel | Germany |
| Braunschweig | Germany |
| Salzgitter | Germany |
| Chemnitz | Germany |
| Osnabrück | Germany |
| Kaluga | Russia |
| Nizhny Novgorod | Russia |
| Bratislava | Slovakia |
| Martorell | Spain |
| Pamplona | Spain |
| Palmela | Portugal |
| Poznań | Poland |
| Września | Poland |
| Győr | Hungary |
| Kvasiny | Czech Republic |
| Mladá Boleslav | Czech Republic |
| Vrchlabí | Czech Republic |
| Puebla | Mexico |
| Chattanooga | USA |
| São Bernardo do Campo | Brazil |
| São Carlos | Brazil |
| Curitiba | Brazil |
| Anchieta (São Paulo) | Brazil |
| Uitenhage | South Africa |
| Port Elizabeth | South Africa |
| Kaluga | Russia |
| Nizhny Novgorod | Russia |
| Relizane | Algeria |
| Pune | India |
| Aurangabad | India |
| Samut Prakan | Thailand |
| Jakarta | Indonesia |
| Pekan | Malaysia |
| Pacheco | Argentina |
| Anting (Shanghai) | China |
| Foshan | China |
| Changchun | China |
| Chengdu | China |
| Urumqi | China |
| Ningbo | China |
| Tianjin | China |
| Hefei | China |
| Bratislava | Slovakia |
| Sarajevo | Bosnia and Herzegovina |
| Lagos | Nigeria |

This list includes many of the major Volkswagen production facilities worldwide. Some countries have multiple factories, and the list includes those that are wholly owned by Volkswagen as well as joint ventures and subsidiaries.

Quote (Malopox @ Sep 4 2024 12:35am)

Majority of Volkswagen factories are outside of Germany in countries like China, Russia, Brazil, India. Getting rid of low efficiency, unproductive German factories will benefit Volkswagen. They should also consider moving headquarters away from Germany to eg Switzerland or US to escape German green left.

Quote (Malopox @ 4 Sep 2024 07:35)

Majority of Volkswagen factories are outside of Germany in countries like China, Russia, Brazil, India. Getting rid of low efficiency, unproductive German factories will benefit Volkswagen. They should also consider moving headquarters away from Germany to eg Switzerland or US to escape German green left.

Quote (iLoveMyUsername @ 22 Sep 2024 05:42)

French President Emmanuel Macron announces new right-wing government

Source: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c8rd52zl018o