Quote (ofthevoid @ Sep 8 2020 04:22pm)

I posted a source talking about a congressional vote in which the Armed Services committee literally put in place certain very difficult to achieve points for troop draw down to happen in Afghanistan and you're doubling down. The purpose of the amendment is specifically to prevent Trump from doing this.

If Democrats supported leaving Afghanistan the bill would have not passed 44-11. There's 26 republicans on that Committee. Let's assume they all voted 'for' this amendment that still means at least 18 other democrats voted to put in place rules making it impossible for Trump to draw down.

It's pretty astounding how on a daily basis you accuse others of something you are guilty of. Someone can post sourced proof showing that Trump did try to bring troops home only to fail because of constant and verifiable opposition and you blame Trump, as if the congressional check had nothing to do with it. There's no complete pass, there's observing reality. He tried to bring troops home, cabal of hawks in both parties acted against it. Easy for an isolationist to choose sides here.

Quote (IceMage @ Sep 8 2020 04:38pm)

So you dodged the question of whether Trump or his administration protested that amendment. Here's a bunch of Democrats doing just that:

https://www.salon.com/2020/07/22/democrats-join-with-gop-to-vote-down-ilhan-omars-plan-to-withdrawal-us-troops-from-afghanistan_partner/

Democrats were about evenly split on it... only 2 Republicans supported it. So fair to say that Democrats are more willing to let Trump cut and run from Afghanistan, but he won't do it because of Lindsey Graham and the generals, even though the cult is with him?

And that's a good enough excuse for you. I guess when Trump's supporters are so easily pacified, there's no wonder why he fails to deliver on promises.

E - The last sentence is just more tribalism. This isn't the voting booth, we're not choosing sides. We're discussing a topic.

Quote (ofthevoid @ Sep 8 2020 05:06pm)

So the narrative went from Democrats support getting out of Afghanistan to herp derp Trump just wants to cut and run that's why they opposed him in bringing troops home?

You were just critical of isolationist supporting Trump even though he 'failed' (at least on one front) to bring home troops. It's been thoroughly shown why he failed and your response is to cry and blame Trump, refusing to acknowledge how much is actually outside his control on the matter.

It's like if someone's riding a bike and a guy comes up and puts a stick in the spokes stopping the bike. Most people understand why the bike stopped and no one has a warped enough logic to say the person riding the bike failed to ride the bike but understand that the outside force stopped the bike, but here we have Icemage in usual TDS fashion with Trump being the ultimate denominator no matter the evidence.

Quote (IceMage @ Sep 8 2020 05:54pm)

Do I have to explain why that's a worthy distinction? Just because Democrats support Trump's overall goal of withdrawing from the Afghan conflict doesn't necessarily mean they support it regardless of the terms of withdrawal.

Not true. I'm critical of people who claim to believe something yet don't hold the people they support accountable if they fail. This is what has happened for Trump's whole presidency... if something doesn't get done, the blame is cast onto another. The cult motto is "Trump cannot fail, he can only be failed". Any political movement that doesn't hold their leaders accountable is a cult. That's the argument you're making now.

Quote (EndlessSky @ Sep 8 2020 03:42pm)

Its exactly what the Democrats did. Its the same reason why the Democrats spread fake rumors about Putin putting bounties on American soldiers in Afghanistan.

Quote (Goomshill @ Sep 8 2020 01:34pm)

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2020/09/07/u-s-ambassador-france-denies-atlantic-story-potus-never-denigrated-any-member-us-military/

A statement from Jamie McCourt, Ambassador to France who was present with Trump not just on the trip to France but physically in the room when Trump called off the trip to the cemetery at Belleau Wood





At this point, its clear that Jeffrey Goldberg's story is a fabrication. There literally aren't 4 people left who could have witnessed such a statement because everyone on the trip is accounted for except John Kelly, who hasn't said anything yet and seems unlikely since he would not have stayed silent until now, he wouldn't have let something like that pass.

How can there be four US officials to anonymous confirm this story as eyewitnesses, if we can account for every possible US official eyewitness?

Quote (ofthevoid @ Sep 8 2020 07:23pm)

I've lost track of complete fabrications or dishonest spins the media has attempted to try to paint Trump in a bad light, i'm just sitting here wondering at what point do people start looking at this vast body of evidence and question some of their assumptions of Trump.

Like holy shit is he given a lot of material to point to that he can reference as to why he calls the media 'fake news'.