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Jul 17 2013 11:45am
Quote (AEtheric @ 17 Jul 2013 02:24)
"You will die physically, but you will be born again; being born happens, or you would not be here now. You were born into this life. It is what we know happens for certain to everyone living. There is no evidence anything else happens."

Non-sequitur.  We are born and we die. So it's partially right that there is no evidence of anything else happening, such as being born again. How does he know we're born again. I don't see any logical proof or evidence that we are.

"Definition of ultimate truth: It is knowing the truth of life. It is knowing the fundamental, eternal laws of nature, and the nature of the mind which distorts and hides the truth. It is an accurate and complete understanding of “that which is.”"

If you define truth as 'that which is' you run into a whole gamut of problems mainly because it is such a broad definition that we coiuld practically fit anything into it. I could say that my friend and my friend only is the ultimate truth, because he is.  If they had rephrased it to say 'Being itself is the truth', then I would see the point, but they do not, and they leave the answer so open-ended that it would be painful to watch people like you try to describe the truth to others.  As we advance, scientifically, we find out more and more that we didn't know was, and we even find out that sometimes it is impossible to say whether or not something truly is or isn't.  For instance, we cannot say that Godel's Incompleteness theory gives a true or false answer, although it is reliable, and does prove something.  Same thing with the problem of the continuum hypothesis.  We don't know if it's true or false, and people have proven that it's impossible to say either one.


For what you said about "being itself is the truth", here is a related quote from the book you are supposed to read before posting :

Quote
Change: The key truth is the knowledge of the balancing opposites, because you can see this truth in action everywhere you look. Change or movement is caused when parts of a cycle or system are out of balance. They always will move or change to balance. Example: In the weather system, when there is a high pressure zone and a low pressure zone, the air in the high pressure zone will move into the low pressure zone causing wind and bad weather. If you are hungry, you eat, etc.

There are two types of truth: truth you know and the truth you experience.
The mind truth is the opposite of the living or real truth. They cannot exist together, so you have to sacrifice one for the other. Mankind is currently sacrificing life for the mind. We just have to do the opposite. We have to start living in “that which is” and stop just thinking about it all the time. We just have to get our minds out of the way; they are blocking true life. You do not have to think if you know life.

The truth and life: When you know the truth, you can be completely aware of everything coming to you through your life senses; you will experience true life.

Truth = life, life = truth, but you have to learn all the truth to get all the life.

The more you see the truth, the more you will see the life. The more you see life, the more you will see the truth. They build on each other, and your knowledge of them grows until you know life completely and become life.

Truth first: People have it backwards. They want true life before they know the truth, and as a result, they never get the truth or life. People can get close and look like they have it all, especially the big stars in show business. They look like they are full of life and everyone wants to be like them, but they do not have it all. Even having 99% is not all of it. You need it all to take the next step in evolution and become a spiritual being. How can you live completely what you do not know completely? When you know life completely, you start living it completely.

How can you enjoy life before you know how life works? No one can fully enjoy life until they know why things happen and where their life will lead. Money, sex, success, power, fame, will not work. The truth is the only way.


From page 13 of "The Present" at http://www.truthcontest.com

This post was edited by Eti_fr on Jul 17 2013 11:45am
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Jul 17 2013 04:55pm
Quote (mrpopos10 @ Jul 16 2013 10:10pm)
Don't encourage him


I love how he says "one more time" in the topic description but has bumped this crap a ridiculous amount of times.
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Jul 18 2013 09:06am
Quote (AEtheric @ 17 Jul 2013 02:24)
"You will die physically, but you will be born again; being born happens, or you would not be here now. You were born into this life. It is what we know happens for certain to everyone living. There is no evidence anything else happens."

Non-sequitur.  We are born and we die. So it's partially right that there is no evidence of anything else happening, such as being born again. How does he know we're born again. I don't see any logical proof or evidence that we are.

"Definition of ultimate truth: It is knowing the truth of life. It is knowing the fundamental, eternal laws of nature, and the nature of the mind which distorts and hides the truth. It is an accurate and complete understanding of “that which is.”"

If you define truth as 'that which is' you run into a whole gamut of problems mainly because it is such a broad definition that we coiuld practically fit anything into it. I could say that my friend and my friend only is the ultimate truth, because he is.  If they had rephrased it to say 'Being itself is the truth', then I would see the point, but they do not, and they leave the answer so open-ended that it would be painful to watch people like you try to describe the truth to others.  As we advance, scientifically, we find out more and more that we didn't know was, and we even find out that sometimes it is impossible to say whether or not something truly is or isn't.  For instance, we cannot say that Godel's Incompleteness theory gives a true or false answer, although it is reliable, and does prove something.  Same thing with the problem of the continuum hypothesis.  We don't know if it's true or false, and people have proven that it's impossible to say either one.


An other quote to answer your post :

Quote
It is all true: The truth is simply everything there is, everything that truly exists. If it does not exist, it is not the truth; if it does, it is. “That which is” is everything except for the deceptions created by the mind.
(from page 10 of "The Present")
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Jul 18 2013 10:02pm
Quote (Eti_fr @ Jul 18 2013 10:06am)
An other quote to answer your post :

(from page 10 of "The Present")


What are some of these deceptions?
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Jul 19 2013 08:04am
Quote (IceMage @ 19 Jul 2013 05:02)
What are some of these deceptions?


Everything you think is not part of reality/that which is/the present.
Everything else (all you can see, hear, taste, smell and sense) is reality.

It is very simple, but we are so close to the problem (our deceiving minds) that it is hard to see.
If you pay attention to your mind and life, your mind will stop deceive you, become rational and your best friend. It will open itself and help you to "open the present", fully receive life through your senses.

Quote
All people want is what is in the present, but they do not know it because they have never opened it. Almost no one knows what the present really is.
(from page 7 of "The Present").

This post was edited by Eti_fr on Jul 19 2013 08:13am
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Jul 20 2013 01:14pm
Bump
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Jul 20 2013 01:58pm
Quote (Eti_fr @ Jul 19 2013 09:04am)
Everything you think is not part of reality/that which is/the present.
Everything else (all you can see, hear, taste, smell and sense) is reality.

It is very simple, but we are so close to the problem (our deceiving minds) that it is hard to see.
If you pay attention to your mind and life, your mind will stop deceive you, become rational and your best friend. It will open itself and help you to "open the present", fully receive life through your senses.


Is there any reason for thought? Should we give up thinking all together?

What role should the mind play in someone's life?

This post was edited by IceMage on Jul 20 2013 02:07pm
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Jul 20 2013 02:06pm


I will let this convey how I feel about your post..hope you don't mind. I like this thread and this belongs here.

it is like a finger pointing at the moon, don't concentrate on the finger or you will miss all that heavenly glory...
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Jul 21 2013 04:49am
Quote (IceMage @ 20 Jul 2013 20:58)
Is there any reason for thought?  Should we give up thinking all together?

What role should the mind play in someone's life?


Your mind will always be here for you when needed, but it will open itself when not needed so you can fully receive life through your senses.
It will only open itself if you can see it, understand you are more than your temporary mind.
Your mind must be the servant of your spirit, it is currently trying to control your spirit/life and escape reality to avoid pain/death... which is obviously impossible.
We were all born that way, nobody is to blame... It is just time to be honest and understand we have to change, emancipate ourselves from mental slavery and come back to life.

Here is a quote from "The Present" about it :

Quote
Mind-self: The mind is a great tool if we have it under control. The problem is that most don’t have their minds under control. The mind has been so useful to our survival that we have given it complete power over our lives.

We have begun to believe that we are our minds. This falsehood puts our minds in control of us.

We cannot be our minds, because our minds end at death, and we do not. We cannot, because we are immortal, and our minds or brains are not. Our mind is a biochemical and bioelectric part of our bodies. It exists in the brain, and it is destroyed when the rest of our body is destroyed at death, just as a computer’s data is destroyed when a computer’s hard drive is destroyed. Your mind can be destroyed even sooner than death by brain injuries and diseases, such as Alzheimer's and some mental diseases.

We can be certain that we are not our mind, because if it was gone, we would still be here. We would still be aware of life, actually more aware of life, completely aware of it. The mind does not give us life; we give the mind life.

The mind’s job is done: The mind is like a sophisticated computer. Its function is to learn, remember, process, and understand life and the things in it. The ultimate thing for the mind to learn and understand is the nature of life itself; our true past, potential future, and the nature of nature. Once we know the ultimate truth, our mind’s ultimate job is done. Its reason for evolving is accomplished. Thus, the mind’s purpose is fulfilled. When the truth is known, it is finished.

Master/servant: Once you know the “mind truth” or “intellectual truth,” your mind can take you no further. The mind needs to relax and become just a technical consultant. The mind needs to become your servant and stop being your master.


This is just a small quote, you should really read the whole book...
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Jul 21 2013 07:26am
Quote (Eti_fr @ Jul 21 2013 05:49am)
Your mind will always be here for you when needed, but it will open itself when not needed so you can fully receive life through your senses.
It will only open itself if you can see it, understand you are more than your temporary mind.
Your mind must be the servant of your spirit, it is currently trying to control your spirit/life and escape reality to avoid pain/death... which is obviously impossible.
We were all born that way, nobody is to blame... It is just time to be honest and understand we have to change, emancipate ourselves from mental slavery and come back to life.


I agree with you, I think a lot of us have an unhealthy relationship with our minds.
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