I used that word specifically because that's what you claimed. Specifically you said "You claimed for years that Russia somehow hacked or influenced the 2016 election"

You're being so emotional you can't even realize what you're saying.


For the record, nobody on this forum ever seriously defended Russia directly hacking the election and changing votes. I know you guys have to pretend we're all irrational Trump haters, but nobody I ever saw did anything other than float it as a possibility, and never seriously defended it.

This post was edited by Thor123422 on Dec 12 2020 02:12pm

Ah, that was a misspeak on my part. "Interfered with" it should have read.

About the "emotional" shit, I'm laughing so hard at you. You're reaching so desperately for something that you go to "emotional".

About your attempt to backtrack your Russiagate hoax, shall we pull all your responses from that thread? You were quite active as I recall. Or perhaps you should stop being "emotional" and stop trying to deflect.

Edit: Oh, forgot to mention, quit dodging. Dominion Voting Systems is a foreign company using proprietary software and hardware. Thus, direct foreign involvement in US elections, the very vote itself, no less. How is this okay? If you're so certain in everything you say, it should be very simple for you to explain how this is reasonable.

This post was edited by InsaneBobb on Dec 12 2020 02:29pm

While the fact that the DNC was hacked is an indictment on the competence of their IT security (or lack thereof), it has nothing to do with the central claim of the Russiagate conspiracy theory, that the Trump campaign was actively in cahoots with Russian operatives to steal data and otherwise rig an election victory for Donald Trump. Alternatively, that Russia somehow had compromat on Donald Trump and he was a creature of the Kremlin. These allegations were spread by various news outlets (e.g. the New York Times, MSNBC, CNN), completely without evidence, and they've been thoroughly discredited.

I have never tried to backtrack on my claims about Russiagate. I never did anything more than float election hacking as a possibility, and I'm pretty sure I dropped it before January since no evidence had yet come out. As to what Russia did, they absolutely influenced the Trump campaign, and lead a systematic disinformation campaign in Trump's favor with Trump's campaign manager passing along polling data to allow them to do it better, and during the Trump administration he actively obstructed the investigation in a way that would have been criminal if it was done by anybody besides the executive, and may still be even if he can't be charged while in office.

Dominion is a company that operates in Canada and the United States. I have no concern that they are "foreign". Hand recounts of ballots where these machines are used have turned up equal results, and Trump won states where they are used like Utah, and this absolutely disproves the idea that they changed the outcome.

This post was edited by Thor123422 on Dec 12 2020 02:44pm

How did Russia "influence the Trump campaign"? Trump's campaign just hammered the same points over and over ad nauseum. The only "influence" outside of the standard talking points that Trump was already shouting out at rallies during the primaries were in regards to the Wikileaks dumps, and those would be Wikileaks influence, not Russian influence. Again, Assange says his source was not Russian. Why would I believe some random company paid by the DNC over Assange? Did you bother to examine any of that information? Trusting the DNC is the height of stupid.

And what hand recounts are you referring to? Do you mean the initial Georgia recount which was NOT a hand recount, it was put through the machines again? There have been a number of hand recounts that showed more votes for Trump, irregularities in ballots, dead people voting, etc. I'm all up for the answer of "not enough to sway the election" and that's fine. My concern isn't with the result, it's the methodology. It is a foreign company using proprietary software and hardware. Machines are wiped and votes cannot be audited. The verification process is highly suspect, and unlike Americans, Dominion Voting Systems has nothing to lose if something goes wrong, but potentially everything to gain if something is fixed.

It's just a simple question. I'm not making accusation of fraud, I'm saying, it's a US Election, why is a foreign company involved in vote casting machines and tabulation machines in a US election. That is direct foreign involvement in what is supposed to be a secure American voting system. And I'm going to be honest, Democrat, Independent, Republican, everyone should be very interested in a real answer for this question. Once you outsource your voting system to a foreign entity, you've just outsourced your elections to foreign entities. Even working based on the theory that there were absolutely zero irregularities, zero fraud, zero "user errors" etc. it's still the question of, "Why does a foreign entity have this level of access and potential to interfere in our election, especially after all the hubub from 2016?" I would think that Republicans would want a full investigation just in case maybe Trump or some other republicans won and were cheated, as well as legislation to prevent further foreign entity interference in the future. I would think that Democrats would want a full investigation just to get Republicans to shut the fuck up, and prove that there was nothing untoward, but again, agree to the legislation to remove even the appearance of outside interference, ESPECIALLY after a 3 year special investigation of the 2016 election. As for Independents, I'd say most fall into one camp or the other, and in both cases, a full investigation would be required.

And no, I do NOT expect any "relief" from such an investigation. If the EC votes Biden on Monday, and Congress certifies that vote on the 6th, and it's Biden, Congratulations to President Biden! Even if an investigation turns up that there was fraud out the ass and the election was TOTALLY stolen in key states. Don't care. By that point, it's a done deal. My ONLY concern is with those specific machines by this foreign entity. Don't really feel that who the next president is is relevant.

The CIA looked at the evidence and concluded it was two Russian agencies.

I'm not trusting the DNC, I'm trusting Trump's executive branch.

Dude, you're ignorant of things that came out almost 4 years ago. There's really no reason to talk to you if you can't even do a basic google search. I'm not here to hold your hand.

No, the CIA went based off the "expert opinion" of CrowdStrike, with the "corroborating evidence" of the bs Steel Dossier. And if you believe Clapper is a credible source you have a hole in your head. The CIA never got to examine the DNC servers. The only analysis perfomed on their servers was performed by private companies in the employ of the DNC. And if you wanted to go with Hillary's private Email server and all her emails, including those where she was transmitting classified information, your case is even worse.

You're beating a horse that's so dead it's not even funny. Further, when the DNC tried to bring a civil suit to bear, the NY judge dismissed it with prejudice. Further, he stated flat out that even if the Russian Government had directly obtained the information and handed it directly to the Trump team, it would be within the Trump team's legal rights to publish, since they did not participate in the hack itself.

You may wish to reserve your comments of ignorance prior to posting such utter horseshit. And man, believing Clapper. How about them WMDs dude?

I love how you started with "No intelligence agency concluded Russia did the hack" and then moved the goalposts to "lol you believe American intelligence agencies?"

This post was edited by Thor123422 on Dec 12 2020 03:32pm

Excuse me? I said no intelligence agency performed forensic analysis of the DNC servers. That is 100% factually accurate. So the only analysis was performed by private companies under the direct employment of the DNC. So, looking at it from a third party perspective, what I see is that Clapper, a career liar said that HE had concluded based on the debunked Steel Dossier (paid for by the DNC) and the conclusions of CrowdStrike, a private company paid by the DNC that the Wikileaks dumps were the result of a Russian hack. Okay, so, what we have here is no direct access to the actual evidence by any intelligence agency. All of the DNC dumps (as well as the Clinton emails) were vetted and confirmed legitimate. Assange said it was NOT Russians.

So your claim is that you believe "US Intelligence". But it's not "US Intelligence" is it? It's James Clapper. The guy who perjured himself in front of Congress by claiming the NSA does not collect data on American citizens, the guy who advised the Bush Administration of the dire threat of WMDs in Iraq, and not "Trump's Intelligence Agency" but a guy who resigned in November 2016. Who gives a flying fuck what he "concluded"? His testimony was worth less than nothing.

And I never once said anything about "lol you believe American intelligence agencies". Take your strawman and sit on it. I indirectly said you're a fucking idiot for believing Clapper, and trying to use his personal conclusions as some kind of validating source for your tinfoil hattery.

The level of stupid you reach here, yet you don't have any concerns whatsoever about proprietary machines from a foreign entity being used to vote and tabulate votes in the US election. You're a real work of art.