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Jun 8 2021 01:46pm
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Jun 8 2021 06:31am)
This is not about voter fraud, it is about Democrats trying to push through their wishlist in terms of election reform to tip the scales in their favor.

For example, this bill, HR1 or the 'For the People Act', would make Election Day a national holiday for federal workers. In other words: the party of big governments wants to make it a holiday for one specific group of workers which, by sheer "coincidence", happens to be massively D-leaning (because their jobs literally depend on the scope of the federal government), but not for everyone else? Like... are you fucking kidding me? No one in their right mind can claim that this is a good faith bill by the Dems.


This is completely unnecessary, just use mail ballots lol. The fact that we even have an election day shows how far we are behind the times.

Quote (Black XistenZ @ Jun 8 2021 07:07am)
I think we really have to distinguish between normal partisan bickering over election rules on the one side, and attempts to establish blatantly undemocratic provisions on the other.


The Dems did a good job seizing the opportunity presented by the unique pandemic environment to push through changes which, on balance, benefitted them electorally, like expanded mail-in voting, same day registration, early voting and so on. They often times passed these changes via executive or judicial fiat. It is fair if the GOP tries to roll these back.

On the other hand, stuff like giving the governor or the state legislature the right to overturn the popular vote and certify their state for the candidate who lost it, is a complete non-starter and ridiculous. To be fair though, suggestions in this direction have mostly come from the far-right fringe, the hardcore tankies trumpies, not from mainstream Republicans.


If the amendments pass state legislatures, then I would consider them mainstream.

Out of curiosity, are you against making it easier to buy a gun because it would disproportionately affect Republicans? I don't really have a problem with making it easier to exercise your rights but you seem to have a big problem with it.

This post was edited by thundercock on Jun 8 2021 01:50pm
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Jun 8 2021 01:48pm
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Jun 8 2021 08:31am)
This is not about voter fraud, it is about Democrats trying to push through their wishlist in terms of election reform to tip the scales in their favor.

For example, this bill, HR1 or the 'For the People Act', would make Election Day a national holiday for federal workers. In other words: the party of big governments wants to make it a holiday for one specific group of workers which, by sheer "coincidence", happens to be massively D-leaning (because their jobs literally depend on the scope of the federal government), but not for everyone else? Like... are you fucking kidding me? No one in their right mind can claim that this is a good faith bill by the Dems.


That's not true, like at all. Federal holidays are massively immitated by industry. They can't mandate time off for private companies, but making it a federal holiday is the closest thing they can do to achieving that goal.

So while on paper it's "only mandatory for a small set of workers", in practical terms, it will almost certainly get adopted by a lot of industries.

This post was edited by Thor123422 on Jun 8 2021 01:50pm
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Jun 8 2021 02:10pm
Quote (Thor123422 @ 8 Jun 2021 21:48)
That's not true, like at all. Federal holidays are massively immitated by industry. They can't mandate time off for private companies, but making it a federal holiday is the closest thing they can do to achieving that goal.

So while on paper it's "only mandatory for a small set of workers", in practical terms, it will almost certainly get adopted by a lot of industries.


It would still not get adopted by some industries while applying 100% for one of the most Dem-friendly voting blocs (federal employees), and thus be a net positive for Democrats. And I think you underestimate the number of people who would not get a day off, and thus the magnitude of this effect.

Imho, the best solution would be to move election day to Sunday and/or make it an official holiday everywhere. The true obstacle here is that for some contrived Murica reason, the state apparently can't make holidays mandatory for the private sector in the U.S.

------------------------------


Quote (thundercock @ 8 Jun 2021 21:46)
This is completely unnecessary, just use mail ballots lol. The fact that we even have an election day shows how far we are behind the times.

Wasnt the reason for holding elections on Tuesdays that a devout Christian had to appear in church on Sunday, and voters from the rurals needed up to two days to make it to the polling sites by foot, horse or carriage?
Truly a tradition to be upheld in the 21st century... :lol:

Quote
If the amendments pass state legislatures, then I would consider them mainstream.

Yes, but I'd be surprised if that actually happens. (Talking about the "governor/state legislature can override the popular vote" bills, not the "roll back the mail and absentee voting" stuff.)

Quote
Out of curiosity, are you against making it easier to buy a gun because it would disproportionately affect Republicans? I don't really have a problem with making it easier to exercise your rights but you seem to have a big problem with it.

Casting a vote is a huge responsibility, and quite frankly, many people are not knowledgable and smart enough to make an informed decision. It is for the better of society if certain low propensity, low info voters dont cast a ballot. I have no problem with having a minimum threshold in terms of effort before someone can vote.

Likewise, gun ownership is a huge responsibility, so I dont have a problem with stuff like waiting times or high requirements in terms of gun safety that a potential buyer has to satisfy before he gets his gun. I'm not a 2nd amendment fundamentalist...
In both cases, casting a vote and buying a gun, the requirements must of course not devolve into chicanery. And yes, some of the stuff Republicans have been proposing lately gets into this territory, like the GA law that says helpers may not provide water to people standing in long waiting lines.

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Jun 8 2021 02:14pm
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Jun 8 2021 02:17pm
Quote (theCrossbones @ 8 Jun 2021 20:33)
I think this is a huge talking point.. Was thinking about making a thread over this tbh.
Is it even constitutional to have federal voting laws, does the Fed. have the power to dictated how states vote..
On the other hand, Do we just cut TX ( or example) off of the US and let them secede from the union because letting State Legislators cherry picking results..(as an example) isn't even democracy.
doesn't seem to be a lot of middle ground here.


The Fed obviously has a stake, and therefore should also have a say, in how federal elections are administered.
From a theoretical point of view, I would say that the Feds should stay tf out of state elections, but this is of course a historically fraught issue in the U.S. ...
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Jun 8 2021 02:34pm
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Jun 8 2021 03:10pm)
Casting a vote is a huge responsibility, and quite frankly, many people are not knowledgable and smart enough to make an informed decision. It is for the better of society if certain low propensity, low info voters dont cast a ballot. I have no problem with having a minimum threshold in terms of effort before someone can vote.


Considering Republicans are overwhelmingly more poor, less educated, and less informed, I think this is something we can all get behind. It would basically hand left-wing candidates the keys to the country.
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Jun 8 2021 02:42pm
Quote (thundercock @ Jun 8 2021 02:46pm)
This is completely unnecessary, just use mail ballots lol. The fact that we even have an election day shows how far we are behind the times.



If the amendments pass state legislatures, then I would consider them mainstream.

Out of curiosity, are you against making it easier to buy a gun because it would disproportionately affect Republicans? I don't really have a problem with making it easier to exercise your rights but you seem to have a big problem with it.


ya but like i want one more day off without having to use vacation.
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Jun 8 2021 03:00pm
Quote (Thor123422 @ Jun 8 2021 01:34pm)
Considering Republicans are overwhelmingly more poor, less educated, and less informed, I think this is something we can all get behind. It would basically hand left-wing candidates the keys to the country.


ya and you can sure see that represented in blue run chitholes, people screaming in the streets Burning Looting and Murdering. sure is a stark contrast between your imagination and reality.
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Jun 8 2021 03:00pm
Quote (Thor123422 @ 8 Jun 2021 16:34)
Considering Republicans are overwhelmingly more poor, less educated, and less informed, I think this is something we can all get behind. It would basically hand left-wing candidates the keys to the country.

funny that you’re a dyed in the wool lefty Democrat yet you possess all these parameters. subsidies on subsidies, and blame ‘russia’ for election results you dont like, but ones you do like are secure beyond reproach

your 10+year college experience (which ended in dropping out anyway) hardly counts as ‘’more education’ when you refuse to repay your loan. despite your pale pasty lefty privilege, you blame the company that provided you the money up front which you willingly signed

inb4 some typical passive aggressive frustrated repressed homophobic retort

Quote (thesnipa @ 8 Jun 2021 16:42)
ya but like i want one more day off without having to use vacation.

yeah this

im all for a federal voting holiday. do it now and after the midterms any company with a brain in charge will make it a holiday for their employees.

its always been a squishy sort of come as you go day at the places where i’ve worked anyways. in 2016 the office was basically empty, same in 2012 and i was at a different firm

This post was edited by excellence on Jun 8 2021 03:05pm
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Jun 8 2021 04:32pm
Quote (Thor123422 @ Jun 8 2021 10:34pm)
Considering Republicans are overwhelmingly more poor, less educated, and less informed, I think this is something we can all get behind. It would basically hand left-wing candidates the keys to the country.


just one word

no

Quote (excellence @ Jun 8 2021 11:00pm)
funny that you’re a dyed in the wool lefty Democrat yet you possess all these parameters. subsidies on subsidies, and blame ‘russia’ for election results you dont like, but ones you do like are secure beyond reproach

your 10+year college experience (which ended in dropping out anyway) hardly counts as ‘’more education’ when you refuse to repay your loan. despite your pale pasty lefty privilege, you blame the company that provided you the money up front which you willingly signed

inb4 some typical passive aggressive frustrated repressed homophobic retort



very good post my friend!
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Jun 8 2021 04:39pm
government lefties really need a whole day off to vote?
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