If I objectively look at this:

1. This is a loss for Israel gov, failure on military and intellegence, showed hamas is capable of hitting Israel hard. Israel is starting to lose on PR world wide with images of dead Palestinian children
2. This is an absolute win for hamas, people there believe they are strong and can stand against the fourth strongest army in the world backed by the world super power. With the way Israel is conducting this war, Hamas has access to unlimited recruits, and donations will be massive to rebuild Gaza. Iranians seeing how effective hamas is, I would imagine they will double their budget.
3. This is absolute loss for Iraeli and Palastinian civilians, lots of dead poeple on both sides, cycle will just continue and be more vicious next time.

Thank you for your unbiased opinion which not based on anything
Israel will always lose the PR war because people tend to go with the under dog.

People in Gaza already blaming Hamas on TV like never before so it maybe looks like we are losing to you.
I am pretty sure we are winning and we are also winning the crowd in Gaza when we are the one protecting them going south from Hamas militants

you use the words "you" and "we". I am Canadian American. I have no bone in this fight. Again my comment is my opinion, I could be wrong. But let's check-in next year and see how things are. I would be very surprise if the situation is any different.

So now, who is "We"? Are you Israeli? if so, what does winning look like to you? genuinely curious

Winning means no more Hamas

Winning means a Pseudo two state solution but actually a One state solution.
If you wipe out Hamas without chasing out the other potential extremists in the making.
Hamas 2.0 will be born.

People always like to talk about Terrorism and Terrorist . It is an over used term that means nothing.
Terrorism to me is merely a form of guerrilla warfare to battle against a much more powerful opponent to humiliate, negotiate terms and force a larger and more advanced foe to back down and accept terms that are favorable.

Hamas is a Nationalistic, fundamentalist Islamic based Ideal . If you don't wipe out the idea, it will just keep getting resurrected and you will find no peace.

Terrorism is targeting innocent to achieve political goal
Guerrilla can be used to hit civilians but terrorism is not guerrilla

We will see after the war,

This post was edited by Many_Names on Nov 8 2023 12:17am

Same Same but different but still Same.
When Guerilla warfare doesn't work, terrorism will be applied.

As a Singaporean , I am well versed of what the Malayan Communist Party did during the beginning of our nation building.
We also went through racial riots and being surrounded by Muslim Countries and there are no lacking of radical Islamist.

300 Million Muslims surrounding a country with 2.5 to 2.8 million of ethnic Singaporean Chinese , 500K Ethnic Indians and 80 to 100k Eurasian Singaporean Citizens.

The Chinese Communist Chauvinists did a lot of crap during the 60s and early 70s. But we were pretty lucky to survive them all.

The difference is that this time the Israeli public is United for the cause. In my workplace there are people from all sides of the Israeli political map, left/right you name it. The public demands to disarm Hamas-ISIS, whether they surrender or die. The kidnapped families are protesting against ceasefire since they understand that It’ll take the pressure off Hamas-ISIS and won’t benefit the cause.
In the past, our public was very much concern about PR.. well not in this time. To stop now or to ceasefire will be a mistake from the Israeli point of view and our leaders will bare the consequences if they agree to it.

Exactly

Imho it's certainly not only about Hamas... Which has been initially helped by Israel gov years ago, let's not forget it!
It's mostly a maneuver over decades, to maintain violences in order to justify the elimination of Palestinians and stealing more lands.

This is all documented already, by UN & humanitary NGOs. So Israeli far right gov deserves what it gets: becoming less and less popular at world level, with unfair consequences for real jews living in Europe etc



This post was edited by Meanwhile on Nov 8 2023 03:23am