A lot of people like to say Hamas propaganda, but I just wonder. Is the Hamas really in the position to pump out propaganda? Seems to me that they are poor and unorganized and mostly focused on fighting Israel. My understanding is that propaganda is the province of powerful states like US or Israel that actually have the means to produce it.

Yes, they are. Remember that they have the support of vast propaganda networks in Iran, Qatar (Al Jazeera), Jordan, Lebanon, etc. The propaganda isn't being generated completely by Hamas themselves but aided by their allies.

Yea this is the logical solution and has been since the beginning. This is how you know it was going to turn into a hot war quickly.

When the whole world is basically telling you this is your best option and you choose the "not exactly on the table" option there will be heavy consequences on both sides.

Common sense isn't very common nowadays.

Like most of the progressive left, I don't think he actually believes that the Palestinian Arabs are beings with human agency. It's a shockingly racist worldview. He can no more blame Hamas for their actions than he'd blame a pack of hyenas for chasing down a baby gazelle.

let's just assume that would end the bombing. would it also end the illegal occupation, the starving, the stealing of land, the oppression, the random arrests, torture, and killing of protesters, journalists, kids? would it end the violation of human and international rights, or would it just end the indiscriminate slaughtering of innocent civilians?

we both know the answer, and we both know that israel's far-right government has no intention whatsoever to end their apartheid rule.

people here are NOT asking for israel to stop defending itself, that's a gross misrepresentation. they are asking them to stop starving and slaughtering kids by the thousands, to stop destroying the little space they have to begin with. everyone wants hamas gone. no one has a problem with that. but you don't "target" hamas by carpet bombing half of gaza, by collectively starving and exhausting an already severely deprived population, half of which are kids.

what do you expect to happen once israel's blood-thirst is quenched for the moment, let's assume they eliminated all hamas combatants. you think that's the end of it? have you seriously not learned anything from the last 70+ years? what do you think the people whose homes israel destroyed whose loved ones they slaughtered, whose freedom and dignity they took, will do after the current assault is over? as long as there is an occupation, there will be resistance. you know that. israel knows that. everyone knows that. israel has all the power, it's literally in their hands.

but it looks like bibi chose genocide:



curious how many apartheid apologists will denounce HIM for that. not holding my breath...

This post was edited by fender on Oct 31 2023 09:48am

Nuke Hamas and let God sort them out. Protecting God's people of Israel is paramount. The end times are seemingly getting closer according to Scripture. Get yourselves right with our Lord!

No.

But you are conflating the longer term Palestinian question with the current situation of a massive terrorist attacking having provoked Israel's response.
I'm firmly against what I would also describe as apartheid against Palestinians. I'm against the fervent and illegal settlement of Palestinian land in the west bank.

But I'm even more strongly against terrorist organisations that behead children and burn families in their homes.
Hamas must be destroyed as a credible threat to Israel. Undoubtedly the Palestinian question has to be addressed; But what I see you doing is using the Palestinian question as a way to justify/negate what Hamas has done and what Hamas is.

Hamas is Daesh just repackaged.

Would you reasonably be calling for anyone to negotiate with Daesh?

edit : I will add that I also believe Netanyahu is a fool and a fascist. But the Israeli people have the right to defend themselves, and the fact Israel has a hapless right wing leader does not remove that right.

This post was edited by Prox1m1ty on Oct 31 2023 09:53am

Nuke is a bit overkill for such a primitive group of savages. Just pump their tunnels full of chlorine gas and call it a day

I think it's funny that Israelis forced themselves onto another people who predictably resist, and now they have the gall to say that they are just defending themselves.