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Feb 14 2025 01:51pm
There are far better programs and initiatives money could be flowing to. Will 'conquering Mars' really be in benefit of Americans (or humanity)?
My opinion really boils down to: Space exploration (at a multi-planet level) is of critical importance, at the right time. Humanity is not at that point and it would be at the expense of many less fortunate.
Somewhat off topic, but what do you reckon happens to earth and its less fortunate inhabitants once millionaires resettle in a brand new rock?
I don't think this is reason enough to halt space programs, but earth becoming dystopian wastelands is a real possibility. I don't think any current-day solutions (global regulations, wealth redistribution, sustainable development, ethical innovation) will solve this problem and hopefully AGI will have overtaken us by then.


I think its very clearly the logical progression necessary for exponential population growth to continue without overwhelming the resources of one planet, and our growth isn't being matched by expansion to outer space.
The doomsayers believe it will result in dystopian wastelands aren't accounting for the contracting rate of growth and accelerating rate of mitigation and adaptation- worrying over carbon footprints might be as short sighted as the eugenics movement, it could be a 'solved problem' in our lifetimes. But its still our new manifest destiny to get off this rock and one of the most important steps in adaptation, and we can't neglect it for the same reason we can't neglect other adaptation measures. At any rate, its clearly one of the most noble and long-sighted goals we can put our tax money towards, going to have the biggest impact in human civilization. Don't think anyone is going to claim that for gender-issue mobile games on kenyan phones
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Feb 14 2025 01:57pm
There are far better programs and initiatives money could be flowing to. Will 'conquering Mars' really be in benefit of Americans (or humanity)?
My opinion really boils down to: Space exploration (at a multi-planet level) is of critical importance, at the right time. Humanity is not at that point and it would be at the expense of many less fortunate.

Somewhat off topic, but what do you reckon happens to earth and its less fortunate inhabitants once millionaires resettle in a brand new rock?

I don't think this is reason enough to halt space programs, but earth becoming dystopian wastelands is a real possibility. I don't think any current-day solutions (global regulations, wealth redistribution, sustainable development, ethical innovation) will solve this problem and hopefully AGI will have overtaken us by then.


Pretty reductionist of what they actually do. It's much more than that. It's one of NASAs biggest contractors and it's been that way for many years, way before Elon had any influence on Trump. The reason why NASA uses SpaceX is because they have useful tech. If people want to single out and cry about SpaceX ide expect that same logic applied to every other r&d contractor, but of course they don't because it's not about space tech spend but another dick-riding episode fixated with proving some sort of cronyism. As if his company is the only one that has been used by NASA or received grants and funding.

Here's a good list of NASA spend:




Quote


Based on recent data and reports, here are some of the largest NASA contractors:

California Institute of Technology (Caltech):
Role: Manages the Jet Propulsion Laboratory (JPL), which is responsible for many robotic spacecraft missions like Mars Perseverance and Europa Clipper.
Funding: In FY 2022, Caltech received about $2.7 billion, making it NASA's top contractor.

SpaceX (Space Exploration Technologies Corp.):
Role: Provides space transportation services, including crew and cargo missions to the International Space Station (ISS) with the Crew Dragon and Cargo Dragon spacecraft, and is developing the Starship for the Artemis lunar program.
Funding: SpaceX was awarded approximately $2.09 billion in FY 2022, making it the second-largest contractor.

Boeing:
Role: Involved in multiple NASA projects including the Space Launch System (SLS), Starliner spacecraft for the Commercial Crew Program, and various ISS operations.
Funding: Boeing's contract value has varied, but it has historically been one of NASA's top contractors, although it was surpassed by SpaceX in recent years.

Lockheed Martin:
Role: Key contributions include the Orion spacecraft for deep space exploration, and they have a long history with NASA missions like the InSight Mars lander.
Funding: While Lockheed Martin's specific FY 2022 contract value wasn't highlighted, they are consistently among the top contractors.

Northrop Grumman:
Role: Provides spacecraft and satellite development, notably the Cygnus spacecraft for ISS resupply and involvement in the James Webb Space Telescope.
Funding: Like Lockheed Martin, Northrop Grumman is a significant contractor, with involvement in various high-profile NASA projects.

Jacobs Engineering Group:
Role: Supplies engineering, construction, and technical services across NASA's facilities, including significant roles at centers like Kennedy Space Center for the Exploration Ground Systems program.
Recognition: In 2020, Jacobs was named NASA's Large Business Prime Contractor of the Year.

SAIC (Science Applications International Corporation):
Role: Offers enterprise IT services, engineering support, and space-related services, including work on NASA's space and near-Earth networks.

ASRC Federal:
Role: Provides IT consulting, engineering solutions, and support for NASA's space and science missions, particularly under contracts like the Omnibus Multidiscipline Engineering Services III.


This post was edited by ofthevoid on Feb 14 2025 01:57pm
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Feb 14 2025 02:24pm
Pretty reductionist of what they actually do. It's much more than that. It's one of NASAs biggest contractors and it's been that way for many years, way before Elon had any influence on Trump. The reason why NASA uses SpaceX is because they have useful tech. If people want to single out and cry about SpaceX ide expect that same logic applied to every other r&d contractor, but of course they don't because it's not about space tech spend but another dick-riding episode fixated with proving some sort of cronyism. As if his company is the only one that has been used by NASA or received grants and funding.

Here's a good list of NASA spend:


In a perfect world it would be great if our space program wasn’t dependent on a single private organization, and a fairly new one in the grand scheme of things. But this all a result of the level of stagnation NASA has been known for, decade after decade

And honestly I would like if there was a meaningful competitor to spacex however Boeing , blue origin, etc have been abject failures in this space, no pun intended

This post was edited by Bazi on Feb 14 2025 02:24pm
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Feb 14 2025 02:44pm
In a perfect world it would be great if our space program wasn’t dependent on a single private organization, and a fairly new one in the grand scheme of things. But this all a result of the level of stagnation NASA has been known for, decade after decade

And honestly I would like if there was a meaningful competitor to spacex however Boeing , blue origin, etc have been abject failures in this space, no pun intended


Is it though? Who's stopping any of these other companies to go develop stuff.

I look at SpaceX as a huge positive for the US, their success doesn't mean something negative for NASA or any other company. It's the first company that has developed reusable rocket tech. If the choice is for a NASA (that is fully funded by the taxpayer) vs a private company like SpaceX (that's funded by both public and private dollars), as a taxpayer i want the funding to not be solely placed on the taxpayer.

If some eccentric billionaire, Musk, Bezos, whoever else wants to spend a large part of their fortune, why not let them? I actually want to encourage them. They alone have that type of financial leverage to drive this type of investment.

This post was edited by ofthevoid on Feb 14 2025 02:45pm
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Feb 14 2025 02:51pm
Is it though? Who's stopping any of these other companies to go develop stuff.

I look at SpaceX as a huge positive for the US, their success doesn't mean something negative for NASA or any other company. It's the first company that has developed reusable rocket tech. If the choice is for a NASA (that is fully funded by the taxpayer) vs a private company like SpaceX (that's funded by both public and private dollars), as a taxpayer i want the funding to not be solely placed on the taxpayer.

If some eccentric billionaire, Musk, Bezos, whoever else wants to spend a large part of their fortune, why not let them? I actually want to encourage them. They alone have that type of financial leverage to drive this type of investment.


Nobody is stopping them, it’s just a financial gamble many companies haven’t taken

I am saying it WOULD be great if other companies existed to compete with spacex. No different than military contracts

Bezos is the cofounder of blue origin, as you said an eccentric billionaire spending money to finance another space company, but the company has been a failure so far

This post was edited by Bazi on Feb 14 2025 02:52pm
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Feb 14 2025 03:09pm
Nobody is stopping them, it’s just a financial gamble many companies haven’t taken

I am saying it WOULD be great if other companies existed to compete with spacex. No different than military contracts

Bezos is the cofounder of blue origin, as you said an eccentric billionaire spending money to finance another space company, but the company has been a failure so far


i'd imagine most military applications are the same, the bigger the price tag the smaller the competitor market.

the US may be able to look at bids for ammunitions from hundreds of companies, but for a stealth bomber not so much. even for individual parts in the bomber that are high precision id bet the number able to deliver are small.

i just recognize a funny trend, people are happy when subsidies start and the govt can offload costs to the private sector to solve issues. whether its electric cars to combat climate change or the satellite dominance we need along with space travel to continue being the world's leader for the next 100 years. yet when the company who invest FAR more than the subsidy delivers and profits they get turned on. everyone loved amazon until they say Bezos' net worth. Same for musk.

i saw a reddit comment where someone unironically suggested George Soros doesn't meddle in legislation to go along with his lobbying efforts. as if he just spends millions every election cycle out of philanthropy. every cult of personality hero inevitably develops a hateful mob to match. perfectly balanced as all things i guess.
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Feb 14 2025 03:16pm
i'd imagine most military applications are the same, the bigger the price tag the smaller the competitor market.

the US may be able to look at bids for ammunitions from hundreds of companies, but for a stealth bomber not so much. even for individual parts in the bomber that are high precision id bet the number able to deliver are small.

i just recognize a funny trend, people are happy when subsidies start and the govt can offload costs to the private sector to solve issues. whether its electric cars to combat climate change or the satellite dominance we need along with space travel to continue being the world's leader for the next 100 years. yet when the company who invest FAR more than the subsidy delivers and profits they get turned on. everyone loved amazon until they say Bezos' net worth. Same for musk.

i saw a reddit comment where someone unironically suggested George Soros doesn't meddle in legislation to go along with his lobbying efforts. as if he just spends millions every election cycle out of philanthropy. every cult of personality hero inevitably develops a hateful mob to match. perfectly balanced as all things i guess.


Even among big tier weapons u aren’t reliant on just one company. Lockheed Martin and rtx are two that immediately come to mind. NASA is in a unique position for the time being

People aren’t turning on musk because he’s rich, same with Bezos , Soros, gates etc. people turn on them for political views. Anti vax, anti free speech , blah blah whatever the reason. Bezos and gates are interesting because left or right the modern world is fairly reliant on the products they were instrumental in building. Elons products are more niche , for now.

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Feb 14 2025 03:56pm
Even among big tier weapons u aren’t reliant on just one company. Lockheed Martin and rtx are two that immediately come to mind. NASA is in a unique position for the time being

People aren’t turning on musk because he’s rich, same with Bezos , Soros, gates etc. people turn on them for political views. Anti vax, anti free speech , blah blah whatever the reason. Bezos and gates are interesting because left or right the modern world is fairly reliant on the products they were instrumental in building. Elons products are more niche , for now.


And a few years ago while doing the same space stuff, Musk was the darling of the left because of their EV agenda.
I mean, I have a coastal liberal relative who hides her Ivanka Trump shoes from when she was a minor feminist icon
https://www.theguardian.com/theobserver/2014/may/25/elon-musk-entrepreneur-observer-profile
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Feb 14 2025 03:56pm
more federal workers cut today.

CRYING HARD AS FUCK

(they got an email saying, you're fired)
LOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

This post was edited by Mondain on Feb 14 2025 03:57pm
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Feb 14 2025 04:01pm
And a few years ago while doing the same space stuff, Musk was the darling of the left because of their EV agenda.
I mean, I have a coastal liberal relative who hides her Ivanka Trump shoes from when she was a minor feminist icon
https://www.theguardian.com/theobserver/2014/may/25/elon-musk-entrepreneur-observer-profile


He went from Reddit's darling to Reddit's worst enemy, surpassing even Trump himself. And they still believe themselves to be free thinkers
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