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Dec 28 2022 07:12pm
How To Get To Heaven When You Die?

Up Up, down down, left right, left right...
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Dec 28 2022 08:26pm
Quote (addone @ Dec 28 2022 01:03pm)
Claiming that without magic man in the sky one cannot lead life without unchecked consequence is about as removed from reality as you can get. Consequence is a result of action or inaction it is the law of the universe causality. Action and reaction, all creatures and objects are subject to this. All sentient creatures are aware of consequence through their senses. Animals are more reactionary in a sense that they respond to more basic drivers like hunger, hot/cold, survival, pain/pleasure. Meaning their actions are determined by oh look there is some food better go get it but got to be fast otherwise that snake might catch me.
Where as humans tend to be both reactionary and proactive in their actions and willingness to put instant gratification aside for long term benefit. One does not need to consult "God" on any action because they happen regardless. We can observe the consequences because they manifest themselves through our actions. Should I touch the stove no because I'll burn my hand. Should I rob a bank no because don't want to get shot in the face or see it as a long term benefit to my community.

Christians invented God in their image to justify their actions not the other way around. Some like you claim god as a sort of moral compass that without him one would have no boundaries and will spiral out of control. Laws/rules/agreements are constantly made between individual and nations and those that fuck around find out.
Either through jail or natural response I break a law I go to jail/pay a fine, if you drink 2L of mountain dew every single day your body will dramatically increase chance of diabetes and other health problems. I don't need god to tell me that it's pure science and observation.

Why do people like you see the need to invent fairytales that some extraordinary powerful magic man will smite you if you steal or kill a man? Why can't you just come to a conclusion that that behaviour doesn't work in the context of a happy and productive society. Why does your kind cling to the idea that you will be punished in a some horrible pit of fire for eternity if you work on Sunday?


the better part of you post is nothing more than subjective reasoning.

as a christian i dont do something because of the "fuk around and find out" rule, I dont do it because its wrong.

"invent fairytales" ? I didnt "invent" scripture

there is a higher level of being in scripture simply not found in the world. understand you know nothing about it. comments like "...some extraordinary powerful magic man will smite you if you steal or kill a man?" and " ...punished in a some horrible pit of fire for eternity if you work on Sunday?" shows you havent the foggiest idea what scripture is saying. In my experience every atheist/antitheist 100% no bullchit is monumentally ignorant of the meaning of scripture and that is something to perplex about? unless scripture be true then it makes perfect sense........ atheists/antitheist play their part strengthening my faith..........

you ever ponder the idea of forgiving your enemies or why you have a problem with repentance? have you even heard of these concepts? you wont find any ideas like those in the world. In the world you will follow your urges do what you think you can get away with and adjust the "moral" bar as needed. look at the lefties you contend with, they are convinced they hold the moral high ground.

Quote (joswann1 @ Dec 28 2022 01:52pm)
youre desperately dodging the question. do you believe in god (I know , its been a whole MONTH(!) since youve said it), and if so, can you prove he exists?


nope, its your dodge going to a dialog thats not ours and I am not going to let you do it
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Dec 28 2022 08:41pm
Quote (Zerohour150 @ 29 Dec 2022 01:12)
How To Get To Heaven When You Die?

Up Up, down down, left right, left right...


shoryuken !
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Dec 28 2022 09:48pm
Quote (joswann1 @ Dec 29 2022 06:34am)
I dont need some fairy tale god's fake fairy tale forgiveness


You do though.

Psalm 53:1-3

1 The fool says in his heart,
“There is no God.”
They are corrupt, and their ways are vile;
there is no one who does good.

2 God looks down from heaven
on all mankind
to see if there are any who understand,
any who seek God.
3 Everyone has turned away, all have become corrupt;
there is no one who does good,
not even one
.

Now let's look at Romans 3:9-20

9 What shall we conclude then? Do we have any advantage? Not at all! For we have already made the charge that Jews and Gentiles alike are all under the power of sin. 10 As it is written:

There is no one righteous, not even one;
11 there is no one who understands;
there is no one who seeks God.
12 All have turned away,
they have together become worthless;
there is no one who does good,
not even one.”
13 “Their throats are open graves;
their tongues practice deceit.”
“The poison of vipers is on their lips.”
14 “Their mouths are full of cursing and bitterness.”
15 “Their feet are swift to shed blood;
16 ruin and misery mark their ways,
17 and the way of peace they do not know.”
18 “There is no fear of God before their eyes.”

19 Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God. 20 Therefore no one will be declared righteous in God’s sight by the works of the law; rather, through the law we become conscious of our sin.

You want to talk about being a "decent" human being? Even if you break one sin and never sin again, you are still guilty of sin.

James 2:8-10

If you really keep the royal law found in Scripture, “Love your neighbor as yourself,” you are doing right. 9 But if you show favoritism, you sin and are convicted by the law as lawbreakers. 10 For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it. 11 For he who said, “You shall not commit adultery,” also said, “You shall not murder.” If you do not commit adultery but do commit murder, you have become a lawbreaker.



The standard that was set is perfection, something that we can never do. Jesus is the only one who has ever lived the perfect, sinless life. I don't care how "decent" of a human being you are, you still fail to meet the mark. You can do all these good and wonderful things but they won't save you. You have a huge debt to pay which will be paid in death. What you deserve is to be cut off from the source of life. The only way you can avoid that terrible fate is if your debt is forgiven. The issue was never about whether God exists or not, even if He were to show himself before you, that still won't resolve the heart of the issue, that being sin. You can read the Old Testament and see that the Israelite's had no issue at all whether or not God existed and yet they still stumbled in sin.

You need forgiveness as you are not righteous in God's eyes and it's His judgement that you should care about. You cannot justify yourself by your works. The Bible has made that part very clear.
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Dec 29 2022 03:31am
Quote (CPK001 @ Dec 28 2022 07:48pm)
You do though.

Psalm 53:1-3

1 The fool says in his heart,
“There is no God.”
They are corrupt, and their ways are vile;
there is no one who does good.

2 God looks down from heaven
on all mankind
to see if there are any who understand,
any who seek God.
3 Everyone has turned away, all have become corrupt;
there is no one who does good,
not even one
.

Now let's look at Romans 3:9-20

9 What shall we conclude then? Do we have any advantage? Not at all! For we have already made the charge that Jews and Gentiles alike are all under the power of sin. 10 As it is written:

There is no one righteous, not even one;
11 there is no one who understands;
there is no one who seeks God.
12 All have turned away,
they have together become worthless;
there is no one who does good,
not even one.”
13 “Their throats are open graves;
their tongues practice deceit.”
“The poison of vipers is on their lips.”
14 “Their mouths are full of cursing and bitterness.”
15 “Their feet are swift to shed blood;
16 ruin and misery mark their ways,
17 and the way of peace they do not know.”
18 “There is no fear of God before their eyes.”

19 Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God. 20 Therefore no one will be declared righteous in God’s sight by the works of the law; rather, through the law we become conscious of our sin.

You want to talk about being a "decent" human being? Even if you break one sin and never sin again, you are still guilty of sin.

James 2:8-10

If you really keep the royal law found in Scripture, “Love your neighbor as yourself,” you are doing right. 9 But if you show favoritism, you sin and are convicted by the law as lawbreakers. 10 For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it. 11 For he who said, “You shall not commit adultery,” also said, “You shall not murder.” If you do not commit adultery but do commit murder, you have become a lawbreaker.



The standard that was set is perfection, something that we can never do. Jesus is the only one who has ever lived the perfect, sinless life. I don't care how "decent" of a human being you are, you still fail to meet the mark. You can do all these good and wonderful things but they won't save you. You have a huge debt to pay which will be paid in death. What you deserve is to be cut off from the source of life. The only way you can avoid that terrible fate is if your debt is forgiven. The issue was never about whether God exists or not, even if He were to show himself before you, that still won't resolve the heart of the issue, that being sin. You can read the Old Testament and see that the Israelite's had no issue at all whether or not God existed and yet they still stumbled in sin.

You need forgiveness as you are not righteous in God's eyes and it's His judgement that you should care about. You cannot justify yourself by your works. The Bible has made that part very clear.


preach it brother :)
Member
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Joined: May 17 2005
Gold: 17,384.69
Dec 31 2022 09:09am
Where thou diest, will I die, and there will I be buried: the LORD do so to me, and more also, if ought but death part thee and me.
And whatsoever ye do, do it heartily, as to the Lord, and not unto men;

For which cause we faint not; but though our outward man perish, yet the inward man is renewed day by day.
For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, worketh for us a far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory;
While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

:thumbsup:


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Joined: Mar 13 2009
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Dec 31 2022 06:25pm
Quote (beanbag @ Dec 29 2022 06:45am)
"nothing is so just because you say"

And now we're right back at the start. If there is a god, provide testable evidence. You'd be the first to ever do so in human history. With your capacity, I definitely have doubts.


Remember when the Queen passed away? As the Union Jack was lowered Rainbows appeared at Windsor Castle and at Buckingham Palace.

https://www.townandcountrymag.com/society/tradition/a41123522/rainbow-windsor-castle-queen-elizabeth-death-photos/

To me that was God showing His respect for the Queen.
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Posts: 927
Joined: Jul 6 2010
Gold: 7.99
Dec 31 2022 06:32pm
Quote (CPK001 @ Dec 31 2022 06:25pm)
Remember when the Queen passed away? As the Union Jack was lowered Rainbows appeared at Windsor Castle and at Buckingham Palace.

https://www.townandcountrymag.com/society/tradition/a41123522/rainbow-windsor-castle-queen-elizabeth-death-photos/

To me that was God showing His respect for the Queen.


That's not evidence for a god. That's evidence for a flesh lump with an internet connection and low brain function eager to conflate natural weather occurrences with the supernatural.

This post was edited by beanbag on Dec 31 2022 06:32pm
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Dec 31 2022 07:47pm
When one’s on their death bed, they’ll cry to God because there is that momentary lapse where they think to themselves “what if I’m wrong”
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Dec 31 2022 10:45pm
Quote (beanbag @ Jan 1 2023 10:32am)
That's not evidence for a god. That's evidence for a flesh lump with an internet connection and low brain function eager to conflate natural weather occurrences with the supernatural.


So you are unable to see the signs when they are shown to you. I really hope that you are not a detective or judge in any way, shape or form as you would simply dismiss all types of evidence presented to you.

Maybe you should look for a profession in making beanbags for a living. That seems right up your alley.
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