So then how do you know you have a right if there's nothing that happens when I violate it when you can't defend it.

Seems like a meaningless distinction if nothing happens when I or nature violate it.

This post was edited by Thor123422 on Feb 25 2015 06:38pm

by who?

also you still haven't answered my earlier question

do your rights have a meaningful existence if there is nothing in place to guarantee them?

This post was edited by duffman316 on Feb 25 2015 06:43pm

It is a pretty good shot at making a 'most win/few lose' ruling on issues. The problem with it (just like utilitarianism) is that it is impossible to actually implement in real life.

I've always found those rights to be self evident, and to be granted to us by the writers of the constitution. If we can't depend on the protectors of the constitution to defend us our rights, then I'd hope there would be enough who aren't willing to give up those rights, and to fight for them again.

historically speaking, rights as a whole are a new concept

wouldn't consider it to be self evident given how long people were and in some places are considered property

Were talking about rights not guaranteed by the state specifically

[QUOTE=duffman316,Feb 25 2015 04:38pm]i agree it is subjective and that's simply how things are, the laws are also constantly changing over time to reflect this

society's attitudes towards corporal punishment is a good example of this, societal norms will always play a significant role in legislative processes

if you can bring about the downfall of the govt by circulating a few flyers i'd say go for it but i doubt you'll find a consensus that taxes should be reduced to zero[/QUOTE]

i can always respect that

But the right to life, and liberty, and to hold property are protected by the constitution aren't they? what other rights are being talked about?

Santy thinks he has rights regardless of if they are written down and protected.

doesn't he?

haven't we evolved enough as a species to expect a base or core set of rights?
We have evolved enough to cure or find vaccines to almost any sickness that attacks us (almost)
we have evolved enough to send men into outer space
we have evolved enough to make it possible to communicate with almost anyone no matter where they are on this planet
we have evolved enough to make one bomb that can kill millions at one blast
with a world society that has evolved to this point
don't you think we have evolved enough to expect these basic rights without having them written down?
don't you think that we as fellow human beings, who have evolved to this state of intelligence should defend his fellow man these rights?