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#311
Jul 3 2019 03:15pm
Quote (thesnipa @ 3 Jul 2019 20:54)
in a personal setting they're somewhat analogous. but aids is a factor trans people cant match on a social level.

but from societal standpoint the two are incomparable. gay men in the 80s were nothing but a running joke, with most of the punchlines being about them dropping like flies. imagine if every single stand up routine had jokes about trans suicide rates, rather than it just being the one-off hardly laughed at middle joke from an edgy alt right guy. they had no representation in movies or TV unless it was equally as mocking OR a hypersexualized deviant representation OR a predator of children. trans people have incredibly representation in media today, from kiddie gloves treatment by pandering outlets such as HuffPo to reality shows like I am Jazz and RuPaul's Drag Race (plz for the love of god dont give me a snarky actchuallllyyyyy about the differences between CDs and trans), mainstream representation of actresses such as in Orange is the New black and many gender fluid stars like Ruby Rose.

to be frank your reaction of a reluctant "probably" is one of the main reasons that gay narrative exists. they're fine with you guys not having to earn it as hard as they did, as long as you recognize that reality. the constant messaging implying you dont have a far shorter curve than they did, and incomparably so, causes a lot of resentment. same thing that drives TERF mentality in lesbians.


It wouldn't be snarky. RuPaul has been openly criticised for his transphobia.
'a far shorter curve'? You do realise that trans people existed back then too right? The curve has been long with a recent sharp uptick in the last decade.

Yes, in general trans people have it better than gays in the 80s. My point was that some trans people have it just as bad... because some people haven't moved on since the 80s... And some of those people happen to be the parents of trans people. Some of them are in government and are pushing legislation and shit.

Though I dunno why you want to play this 'oppression olympics' game of who has it worse. We're not in the 80s. We're in the present and in the present trans people face challenges they really ought not to.
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#312
Jul 3 2019 03:19pm
Quote (TransTankie @ Jul 3 2019 09:15pm)
It wouldn't be snarky. RuPaul has been openly criticised for his transphobia.
'a far shorter curve'? You do realise that trans people existed back then too right? The curve has been long with a recent sharp uptick in the last decade.

Yes, in general trans people have it better than gays in the 80s. My point was that some trans people have it just as bad... because some people haven't moved on since the 80s... And some of those people happen to be the parents of trans people. Some of them are in government and are pushing legislation and shit.

Though I dunno why you want to play this 'oppression olympics' game of who has it worse. We're not in the 80s. We're in the present and in the present trans people face challenges they really ought not to.


I'll return the argument. Trans people are not the only ones suffering and certainly not the ones suffering the most.

Should we try to improve living standards for trans people? Yes. Does that mean that they get priority over people who have it and have had it worse? No way.
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#313
Jul 3 2019 03:23pm
Quote (TransTankie @ Jul 3 2019 03:15pm)
It wouldn't be snarky. RuPaul has been openly criticised for his transphobia.
'a far shorter curve'? You do realise that trans people existed back then too right? The curve has been long with a recent sharp uptick in the last decade.

Yes, in general trans people have it better than gays in the 80s. My point was that some trans people have it just as bad... because some people haven't moved on since the 80s... And some of those people happen to be the parents of trans people. Some of them are in government and are pushing legislation and shit.

Though I dunno why you want to play this 'oppression olympics' game of who has it worse. We're not in the 80s. We're in the present and in the present trans people face challenges they really ought not to.


why I want to?

i'm passing along and discussing the active narrative of middle aged gay men and lesbians.

then your response rung of the exact thing that they say drives that narrative.

"my parents didnt accept me"

"tell me about it, i moved to the city and met hundreds of guys in every club who had literally no relationship with their fathers and a reluctant and distant relationship with their mothers"

etc

your assertion that it's only privileged gays doesnt seem accurate to me either. ive heard from a lot of less than successful men the same thing in interviews. Scott Thompson really is a solid example, izzard got more money in the mainstream acting. Thompson in 2019 is doing nickle and dime shows to make rent and was never paid for his time in Kids n the hall. also multiple deals fell apart and he was ostracized from the group for his gayness. i think you're undervaluing counter culture status.

Quote (balrog66 @ Jul 3 2019 03:19pm)
I'll return the argument. Trans people are not the only ones suffering and certainly not the ones suffering the most.

Should we try to improve living standards for trans people? Yes. Does that mean that they get priority over people who have it and have had it worse? No way.


this sums up my feelings entirely.

This post was edited by thesnipa on Jul 3 2019 03:24pm
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#314
Jul 3 2019 03:23pm
Quote (balrog66 @ 3 Jul 2019 21:19)
I'll return the argument. Trans people are not the only ones suffering and certainly not the ones suffering the most.

Should we try to improve living standards for trans people? Yes. Does that mean that they get priority over people who have it and have had it worse? No way.


I mean I'd argue that trans people are probably the most marginalised group in western society today. Except maybe the mentally ill. Employment rates, suicide rates, homelessness and drug use all seem to reflect that. Even if that is not the case however we can do the trans rights thing, the gay rights thing, the women's rights thing, the disabled rights thing and the black rights thing simultaneously. There need be no prioritising. Different groups and people work for different causes. Many overlap.
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#315
Jul 3 2019 03:25pm
Quote (TransTankie @ Jul 3 2019 03:23pm)
I mean I'd argue that trans people are probably the most marginalised group in western society today. Except maybe the mentally ill. Employment rates, suicide rates, homelessness and drug use all seem to reflect that. Even if that is not the case however we can do the trans rights thing, the gay rights thing, the women's rights thing, the disabled rights thing and the black rights thing simultaneously. There need be no prioritising. Different groups and people work for different causes. Many overlap.


based on the precedent of? a hope and a dream stuffed into a sack?
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#316
Jul 3 2019 03:26pm
Quote (TransTankie @ Jul 3 2019 02:23pm)
I mean I'd argue that trans people are probably the most marginalised group in western society today. Except maybe the mentally ill. Employment rates, suicide rates, homelessness and drug use all seem to reflect that. Even if that is not the case however we can do the trans rights thing, the gay rights thing, the women's rights thing, the disabled rights thing and the black rights thing simultaneously. There need be no prioritising. Different groups and people work for different causes. Many overlap.


It's absolutely mental illness and disability

Native Americans on many of those issues in the US
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#317
Jul 3 2019 03:29pm
Quote (Beowulf @ Jul 3 2019 03:26pm)
It's absolutely mental illness and disability

Native Americans on many of those issues in the US


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#318
Jul 3 2019 03:34pm
has anyone said he deserved it yet? if not, he deserved it
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#319
Jul 3 2019 03:34pm
Quote (thesnipa @ 3 Jul 2019 21:29)
https://i.imgflip.com/34vkar.jpg


There is a lot of overlap. Mostly due to the way society treats trans people.
But being trans doesn't necessarily mean being mentally ill.
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#320
Jul 3 2019 03:35pm
Quote (Jupe @ 3 Jul 2019 21:34)
has anyone said he deserved it yet? if not, he deserved it


I did. That's why they mad.
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