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Dec 15 2022 04:14pm
And on that note, the jury found him guilty of manslaughter, not murder. Even though a self defense claim necessarily precludes both, and if he created the circumstances and shot intentionally it should be murder


Granted IANAL but I wouldn't be surprised if in the near future the social pendulum swings the other way and this conviction could be appealed on the clip in the OP alone. I mean, just mirror everything she said about "those people" to be black and every judge in the country would toss it

This post was edited by Goomshill on Dec 15 2022 04:19pm
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Dec 15 2022 04:20pm
It took me this long to realize that mp4 was encoded without sound lmao
fuck me
well no wonder nobody said anything about it

well 4 pages later:



This post was edited by Goomshill on Dec 15 2022 04:26pm
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Dec 15 2022 04:32pm
Quote (Goomshill @ 15 Dec 2022 20:05)
If all that she could see out the window was her own reflection, how did her nephew next to her identify that there were two officers outside, one male, one female, and the male officer shot her? He saw the same things she did and said she pointed her gun at the officer



He very obviously was coached to lie and changed his testimony. There's not a person in the world gullible enough to believe he mistook what he saw on that night in his statement consistent with the bodycam and other witness and autopsy, but then magically realized his mistake after his family spent 2 years pushing for a $10 million lawsuit. He had no reason to lie in his initial statement, recorded and plainly neither coerced nor fed details. He had 10 million reasons to lie at trial.



You're trying to invent something that wasnt at issue at trial. The prosecution never contested that it was an open structure suspected burglary report. And the handbook clearly calls for a stealth approach. They spent the whole trial citing the handbook for precisely that kind of call and taking issue with the line saying that officers should 'secure all exits'. They tried to argue he broke protocol by walking around the house instead of guarding the front door.

But that clearly is self contradictory. They can't secure all exits if they don't know where the exits are. They had to look around the house to see if it had a back door before they covered it. And police training in approaching around corners and fences calls for two officers, covering each other. They did their approach exactly as trained, as shown at trial. They didn't get to the stage of identifying exits and covering them. And even if they had covered one door and called for backup- not protocol at all- someone would have to go around that corner unannounced anyway, and same situation would unfold.

What kind of response the procedures called for, was never a point of contention. The prosecutors went on absolutely nuts tangents to try to establish some kind of unnecessary risk where there was none. They started talking about how crossing the road could have exposed them to sniper fire from a snipers next on the rooftop. Pretty ridiculously contrived


i'm talking about the FACT that you're outright lying about the nature and content of the 911 call in your OP, just like you're lying about what exactly the kid testified in his initial interview. you're uncritically accepting the cop and his legal defence's versions as the objective truth, lying in order to justify a demonstrably bad and violent cop, who killed a black woman in her own home just seconds after seeing her.

am i surprised? of course not. a serial cop boot licker, someone who tried to justify ahmaud arbery's lynching by racists, would obviously twist the truth in order to make this case appear reasonable and justified, but that obviously doesn't make it so.

and again, in any actually civilised country, no one would have died in this situation. cops wouldn't be scared for their lives every time they do a welfare check on people, residents wouldn't think they needed guns to protect themselves (statistically making it much more likely that they or their loved ones get hurt or even killed btw), and bad cops role playing soldiers or assassins would have been weeded out at police training. what a shithole country, lol...

This post was edited by fender on Dec 15 2022 04:34pm
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Dec 15 2022 04:35pm
Quote (fender @ Dec 15 2022 02:32pm)
and again, in any actually civilised country, no one would have died in this situation. cops wouldn't be scared for their lives every time they do a welfare check on people, residents wouldn't think they needed guns to protect themselves (statistically making it much more likely that they or their loved ones get hurt or even killed btw), and bad cops role playing soldiers or assassins would have been weeded out at police training. what a shithole country, lol...


but, but, mUh fReEduMbz!

your last sentence nailed it. as long as qualified immunity is a thing, cops have and will continue to do whatever the fuck they want without any legal recourse. even if "not all cops" was true, if there were enough good cops, they'd weed out the shitheads like the one in this case. until then, its fuck the police


edit:

the most frustrating part of this is, even if a cop is fired or let go, they can get a job as a cop in the next county over. cops should be licensed just like nurses, barbers , plumbers and literally any other profession there is

This post was edited by joswann1 on Dec 15 2022 04:37pm
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Dec 15 2022 05:39pm
Quote (Goomshill @ Dec 15 2022 02:20pm)
It took me this long to realize that mp4 was encoded without sound lmao
fuck me
well no wonder nobody said anything about it

well 4 pages later:

https://files.catbox.moe/g4daqx.mp4


she played that sustain off pretty smooth though, ngl. not her first rodeo getting absolutely clobbered by an objection :rofl:
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Dec 15 2022 08:04pm
Quote (Goomshill @ Dec 15 2022 04:15am)
Which was a bunch of ass covering in front of the BLM riots. At trial they've gone into detail that officers are instructed to respond to open structure calls on suspicion of burglary in progress, by not alerting residents. That was very clearly the training, the handbook says they should secure all exits and investigate without announcing themselves.

At the trial the prosecutors focused on the 'secure all exits' part by accusing the officers of not following the book because they left the front door unguarded. But thats specious reasoning. They didn't know what exits were on the back of the house, they had to look first, then determine if they could cover it or need to call for backup. The prosecutors made contradictory arguments they should have covered the front (and left the back unguarded), or waited for backup before investigating (leaving the exits unguarded)
As the defense pointed out, even if they had called for backup- not the normal procedure- they still wouldn't be announcing themselves as per training. So someone would still walk around the house and look in that window and the exact same confrontation could unfold

Which all leads back to the question of whether both Atatian Jefferson and Aaron Dean had reasonable beliefs the other person was a robber pointing a gun at them in that split second, that they both has a legal right to be where they were while armed, that they both has a legal right to self defense in reasonable fear for their life and their (partner/nephew). If she had shot first, would she be on trial?

well I guarantee you that if she was, prosecutors wouldn't round out their closing arguments by saying, 'havent you ever know some of *those* black people, you know, *that* kind?


I don't think anything criminal would be the case in terms of either outcome. It's an unfortunate situation that could have been better-handled in 20/20 retrospect.
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