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#31
Nov 19 2022 04:56pm
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Nov 19 2022 11:53pm)
Interference in an election != single-handedly deciding the election.

This point notwithstanding, Russiagate was indeed a big nothingburger which was deliberately blown out of proportion by Democrats and the mainstream media for political gain.


That's what I'm saying all the time so we agree on that
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#32
Nov 19 2022 05:00pm
Quote (IceMage @ Nov 19 2022 11:55pm)
You're arguing against a strawman, and you haven't provided any facts at all.


I don't think we reach an agreement.

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#33
Nov 19 2022 05:00pm
Quote (IceMage @ Nov 19 2022 05:55pm)
You're arguing against a strawman, and you haven't provided any facts at all.


It circles back to why no one trusts media. The allegation was that Trump colluded with Russia to win the 2016 election. That's false. There's no need to be dissimulate.
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#34
Nov 19 2022 05:01pm
Quote (Djunior @ Nov 19 2022 05:56pm)
That's what I'm saying all the time so we agree on that


It's only a nothing-burger for right-wingers because they have no interest in holding Trump accountable for anything. The same facts present for a Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama would have the right-wing going completely crazy, and rightly so.
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#35
Nov 19 2022 05:03pm
Quote (bogie160 @ Nov 19 2022 06:00pm)
It circles back to why no one trusts media. The allegation was that Trump colluded with Russia to win the 2016 election. That's false. There's no need to be dissimulate.


No, that's what the argument eventually became. Because a broader premise would result in Trump having to face how he employed so many people aligned with Russia, and how his troops came so close to criminally conspiring with the Russian government to help him win.
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#36
Nov 19 2022 05:08pm
Reminder: the Republican Senate Intelligence Committee confirmed that Trump's campaign chairman, Paul Manafort, handed over internal campaign polling data during the campaign, to a Russian intelligence officer.

This is a fact. The same fact for Hillary would garner calls from Bogie and others here to have her executed. But they are going to talk about how it's not really a big deal.

And I've created an object lesson about partisanship. Teachers can show this to their students.
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#37
Nov 19 2022 05:14pm
Quote (IceMage @ Nov 20 2022 12:01am)
It's only a nothing-burger for right-wingers because they have no interest in holding Trump accountable for anything. The same facts present for a Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama would have the right-wing going completely crazy, and rightly so.


Fun fact a whole bunch of dems are sick and tired of this shit

https://nypost.com/2022/02/13/most-democrats-want-hillary-clinton-investigated-for-any-role-in-russiagate-scandal-poll/

Quote from article

Quote
A surprisingly large share of Democrats wants to see Hillary Clinton investigated over her possible role in manufacturing dirt to try to tie Donald Trump to the Kremlin, a new poll shows.


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#38
Nov 19 2022 05:22pm
Quote (Djunior @ Nov 19 2022 06:14pm)
Fun fact a whole bunch of dems are sick and tired of this shit

https://nypost.com/2022/02/13/most-democrats-want-hillary-clinton-investigated-for-any-role-in-russiagate-scandal-poll/

Quote from article


So Hillary should be held accountable for rightly pointing out how Trump and his associates had ties to the Russian government?

I'm trying to figure out how that makes Hillary a villain and not a hero.
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#39
Nov 19 2022 05:28pm
Quote (IceMage @ 20 Nov 2022 00:08)
Reminder: the Republican Senate Intelligence Committee confirmed that Trump's campaign chairman, Paul Manafort, handed over internal campaign polling data during the campaign, to a Russian intelligence officer.

How exactly is internal campaign polling data critical to the national security, or sensitive in any other foreign policy sense?



Quote (IceMage @ 20 Nov 2022 00:03)
No, that's what the argument eventually became. Because a broader premise would result in Trump having to face how he employed so many people aligned with Russia, and how his troops came so close to criminally conspiring with the Russian government to help him win.

"Trump's underlings did not collude with Russia, but came too close, so we should impeach him anyway". :rolleyes:
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#40
Nov 19 2022 05:34pm
Quote (IceMage @ Nov 19 2022 06:08pm)
Reminder: the Republican Senate Intelligence Committee confirmed that Trump's campaign chairman, Paul Manafort, handed over internal campaign polling data during the campaign, to a Russian intelligence officer.

This is a fact. The same fact for Hillary would garner calls from Bogie and others here to have her executed. But they are going to talk about how it's not really a big deal.

And I've created an object lesson about partisanship. Teachers can show this to their students.


Kilimnik was a free-lancer who worked with Manafort to drum up consulting fees, which is how Kilimnik and Manafort made money in Ukraine.

This is the last refuge for the "walls are closing in!" crowd. Reality is brutal.
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