This but we have too many lazy people on this planet on can barely wake up in the morning to go on with their gaming.

There are not enough jobs or opportunities for your story to become ubiquitous under capitalism, especially when taking into consideration things on a global level.

It is hyperbolic to suggest that social support is equivalent to raising your children or doing X, Y, or Z for you such that you become devoid of responsibility. Said social support doesn't eliminate individual accountability either.

If that's true though, then the price comes when they reach the age where they wonder what happened.

I know people who have turned their lives around in their 40s. They were definitely good people overall, but they lacked quite a bit in responsibility (as did I for many, many years) and didn't really get it until they were much older. It's never too late. But to think you are just going to "yell very loudly", vote for a certain candidate and be handed a salary that can afford the average house, car and luxuries like a boat and toys in exchange for nothing.....

I'm sorry.... That just is never going to happen. Just at face value, it's not economically viable long term.

No candidate ever in history has everpromised you would be handed a salary that can afford an average house and luxuries. The highest proposal I've seen anybody make for UBI is like $12k a year , which would only be below average in even the poorest areas of the country.

So I'm not sure what you're actually refuting. Seems like you've unintentionally made a straw man out of the actual proposals.

This post was edited by Thor123422 on Jun 6 2021 06:07pm

But, how am I behaving as if I am devoid of any responsibility - fair question? Would you not call any of this a display of personal responsibility? If not, why not?

Also, you didn't even ask me where I began after starting to pull myself out of the crater? To give context, I will share by default:

I began in a call center taking mindless phone calls where I repeated the same script over, and over (and over) for 8 and a half hours a day. They hired anyone and there were 22 people in my original training class. one still remains with the company to date and moved up in her career path as I did (an idea of the turnover/fire rate).

I had no skills, no direction, no fancy, parent funded degree and I needed a job because I had 2 kids, so I took this job that paid less than $23,000 a year. I spent almost 4 years (and minimal raises - I think I barely broke 30 at my highest) in that role learning as much as I could and connecting with as many people as I could. My first promotion I had to apply and interview five times before actually getting it (I was passed up 4 prior).

There is no"I can't" (I mean within reason, we will always "can't" fly by flapping our arms, but that's different), there is "I don't want to" and "I don't feel like putting in that much effort". Neither will honestly never be a justification of expansion of social safety nets that are given away for free at any point. Like I said in my most recent response - at face value, that economic model is not viable long-term in any conclusiary outcome in the realm of possibility.

Do know - none of this is intended to be hostile, but, what I believe is going to be very difficult to change having lived through what I have and being able to take a few seconds every now and then and step back and realize where I made it to today (and I can say the same thing about one of my friends who is black that I used to run with back in the day - he's actually a nurse now on his own merits and got 2 years of schooling for free by working in that same call center i mentioned above - first homeowner in his family ever and I'm damn proud of him).

Everyone can change their "stars" - so to speak

This post was edited by CyrusTheGreat on Jun 6 2021 06:09pm

he doesn't understand "freelancing" he's probably waiting for someone to come offer him a job.

Can you cite the actual economic model you are referencing? You are speaking vaguely about personal responsibility and whatnot. I'd like you to spell out the kinds of things you are railing against, and who is saying them, preferably with the quotes of them saying it.

Well, if you'd be willing to answer the number of questions I have asked, I would be glad to do so in return (however, I will need more context and will clarify at a future point).

As a gentleman's discussion, my questions did come first, so I would have to say the onus is on you first, friend

You don't know him yet. He doesn't answer questions, he'll ask you one instead.

That's what people with no foundation do. Trudeau is the same in Canada. You'll never get an answer from him. Instead he'll ask you something you CBA answering because you CBA trusting said person due to how said person can't answer a simple questions.

You learn to discredit people like him real fast and not pay attention to them.

This post was edited by SunnyvaleTrailerPark on Jun 6 2021 06:14pm

Well, I try to be as fair as possible, so I will give him one more try.

I approach all conversations from a gentlemen perspective and try to hear their thoughts until they aren't sharing them any longer, but rather letting emotions get the best of them.

If no success, oh well - at least I can walk away knowing I did my best to try and find common ground - we need more of these efforts in today's day and age in my opinion