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#31
Feb 2 2021 02:19am
Quote (Handcuffs @ 2 Feb 2021 00:15)
I think it may simply be easier for me to say that I think personal responsibility trumps everything in this discussion for me, and that I don't believe people should be held liable in any form for their speech and that Person A's behavior is their responsibility. That doesn't mean that speech is free from consequences, so I feel that people getting banned, fined, etc. is very different. Those consequences should be commensurate with the speech that is being made, but that consequences that extend to holding one liable for the behaviors of others is unethical imo.


So if I tell you point blank that you should kill person x and provide their address, and you go do so, you should go to prison for murder, and I should get off scott free because... Freedom of speech?
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#32
Feb 2 2021 02:20am
Quote (InsaneBobb @ Feb 2 2021 12:19am)
So if I tell you point blank that you should kill person x and provide their address, and you go do so, you should go to prison for murder, and I should get off scott free because... Freedom of speech?


Yes.

Clarifying: If you're to be held liable for anything, it should be commensurate to your contribution. In this case, this would be your negligence or something similar; however, holding you liable for the actual murder would be unethical to me.

This post was edited by Handcuffs on Feb 2 2021 02:22am
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#33
Feb 2 2021 02:21am
Quote (Handcuffs @ 2 Feb 2021 00:20)
Yes.


Wow. You're a free speech absolutist. That's rare. You do realize that places you solidly on the extreme far right, don't you?
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#34
Feb 2 2021 02:22am
Quote (Handcuffs @ Feb 2 2021 02:36am)
Laws are merely positions.


Not 'my position' though. That's the phrase you used.

This post was edited by Kayeto on Feb 2 2021 02:22am
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#35
Feb 2 2021 02:22am
Quote (Kayeto @ Feb 2 2021 12:22am)
Not 'my position' though.


It's a position that you agree with.
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#36
Feb 2 2021 02:23am
Quote (InsaneBobb @ Feb 2 2021 12:21am)
Wow. You're a free speech absolutist. That's rare. You do realize that places you solidly on the extreme far right, don't you?


Life is more interesting and complex than binaries will ever allow. I also edited clarity into my post.
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#37
Feb 2 2021 02:26am
Quote (Handcuffs @ 2 Feb 2021 00:23)
Life is more interesting and complex than binaries will ever allow. I also edited clarity into my post.


I respect your position. I don't agree with it. I do respect it though. It's been a good chat, legitimately.

"The only bad idea is the idea that doesn't see daylight, and festers in darkness until it spawns violent action."
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#38
Feb 2 2021 02:26am
Quote (InsaneBobb @ Feb 2 2021 12:26am)
I respect your position. I don't agree with it. I do respect it though. It's been a good chat, legitimately.

"The only bad idea is the idea that doesn't see daylight, and festers in darkness until it spawns violent action."


Likewise. Thanks for the thread and responses.
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#39
Feb 2 2021 02:29am
Quote (Handcuffs @ Feb 2 2021 03:22am)
It's a position that you agree with.


source on that?

All I've done so far is point out that "speech that contributes to a suicide" is philosophically the same thing as speech that contributes to any crime (by law).

And that when words become integral to the attempt to commit a crime, then those words cease to be be mere "speech". An idea which you agreed with in post :17

Quote (Handcuffs @ Feb 2 2021 02:16am)
Also, the purchasing of an attempted murder is no longer merely speech.
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#40
Feb 2 2021 02:31am
Quote (Kayeto @ Feb 2 2021 12:29am)
source on that?

All I've done so far is point out that "speech that contributes to a suicide" is philosophically the same thing as speech that contributes to any crime (by law).

And that when words become integral to the attempt to commit a crime, then those words cease to be be mere "speech". An idea which you agreed with in post :17


I don't agree with that though. The exchange of money is no longer merely speech. It's a material exchange under an agreement for action and creates conditional behavior that is no longer individual, but conspiratorial.
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