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May 12 2016 11:11am
Quote (ThatAlex @ May 12 2016 09:06am)
She should release them now. She should have released them months ago.

She insists nothing damning is in them, but if that's true, why hasn't she released them yet? Are we really holding her to a different standard on these transcripts because of her gender?

Hillary is involved in so many scandals and investigations and secrecy, it's crazy. She is the quintessential politician.

Only two presidential candidates have ever been involved during a federal investigation during their campaign: Richard Nixon and Hillary Clinton.


It's strategy and so far a pretty good one. There is no reason to release them when you are running against someone left of you and when you can rightfully point out that she is being held to different standards

and I bet there isn't anything more than slightly embarrassing ass tickling in the speeches which is nothing compared to the benefit of releasing them as an uppercut to Trump at the perfect time

Clinton's transcripts are not comparable to Trump's taxes as far as obligation to release goes
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May 12 2016 11:15am
Quote (AiNedeSpelCzech @ May 12 2016 11:08am)
Yep, this is what I was saying not too long ago. It'd be absolutely perfect for her to hit back with. There's almost certainly nothing in them that's going to hurt her, and it'll be an absolutely perfect counterpunch when Trump tries to use them exactly how Goom Shill outlined. Just wait for the perfect moment where he's ranting and crying about her transcripts, hit him between the eyes with them, and then hammer home that while there's no precedent for sharing speeches like this, there's plenty of precedent for releasing tax returns.

I just hope he waits a bit later in the cycle for that perfect moment, so that the voters don't completely forget.


gushing at length for wall street and singing the praises of bankers who lined their pockets while causing the collapse would utterly destroy clinton as a candidate. If the transcripts were out, the DNC would be scrambling for a new emergency replacement candidate within a fortnight.
Hillary can survive when people just have the vague unprovable notion that she's a corrupt shill for corporate interests, but once they have her on record and can replay it endlessly in the media, she's crucified. We know from witnesses that her language bordered on sycophantic flattery.
Which in turn makes me suspicious if anyone is holding this over her campaigns head as blackmail, and any rogue audience member with a cellphone recording could change the outcome of a presidential race.

Hillary being a morally corrupt pragmatist has clearly done the math and knows that while holding back the transcripts will punish her in the media, shes 1) taking far less drubbing than if she released them and gave quotes to use as fodder against her and 2) her trustworthiness is already utterly beyond repair by all polling, so she stands nothing to gain in doing so and everything to lose.

This post was edited by Goomshill on May 12 2016 11:16am
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May 12 2016 11:20am
Quote (Goomshill @ May 12 2016 12:15pm)
gushing at length for wall street and singing the praises of bankers who lined their pockets while causing the collapse would utterly destroy clinton as a candidate. If the transcripts were out, the DNC would be scrambling for a new emergency replacement candidate within a fortnight.
Hillary can survive when people just have the vague unprovable notion that she's a corrupt shill for corporate interests, but once they have her on record and can replay it endlessly in the media, she's crucified. We know from witnesses that her language bordered on sycophantic flattery.
Which in turn makes me suspicious if anyone is holding this over her campaigns head as blackmail, and any rogue audience member with a cellphone recording could change the outcome of a presidential race.

Hillary being a morally corrupt pragmatist has clearly done the math and knows that while holding back the transcripts will punish her in the media, shes 1) taking far less drubbing than if she released them and gave quotes to use as fodder against her and 2) her trustworthiness is already utterly beyond repair by all polling, so she stands nothing to gain in doing so and everything to lose.


we know just as much about what she said, as we don't know about what she said. Its all just guesswork outside of 'word of mouth'. The Trump side should have a legitimate strategy made up incase they are total nothing burgers and she does release them, because then that leaves him in a very vunerable spot.
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May 12 2016 11:21am
Quote (WidowMaKer_MK @ 12 May 2016 12:10)
...uh , no . The tradition of releasing tax returns has 40 years of precedent , the releasing of the speech transcripts does not .


Her transcripts have been a subject of great discussion and media speculation. If there's nothing damning in there then she should have no problem releasing them. If she wants to be the leader of our nation and we have questions about her past, then we have every right to criticize her if she doesn't answer them.

She also has every right to not release the transcripts, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't criticize it. It's sketchy as hell.

Quote (Beowulf @ 12 May 2016 12:11)
It's strategy and so far a pretty good one. There is no reason to release them when you are running against someone left of you and when you can rightfully point out that she is being held to different standards

and I bet there isn't anything more than slightly embarrassing ass tickling in the speeches which is nothing compared to the benefit of releasing them as an uppercut to Trump at the perfect time

Clinton's transcripts are not comparable to Trump's taxes as far as obligation to release goes


I'm not arguing that it's good strategy, I'm arguing that it's sketchy. The American people have asked to see what is in them and she refuses. She has every right to do that, but we have every right to criticize her for her secrecy.

I'm asking you to step aside from your support of Hillary for a second and just examine her and her history. There are so many scandals and secrets it's crazy. And they all aren't some big, right-wing conspiracy that holds her to a different standard based on her gender. Hillary Clinton is untrustworthy.

And this isn't a competition between Trump and Hillary to see who can be more secretive about their financial pasts. I imagine Trump will release his tax return in due time. I doubt Hillary ever releases those transcripts. That's fine. People are going to keep hounding her about it and bringing up either until she does release them or the election is over.

Bottom line is that she doesn't have to release the information if she doesn't want to, but we have every right to criticize her for that and question it, whether it is good strategy or not.
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May 12 2016 11:25am
Quote (Mangix @ May 12 2016 11:20am)
we know just as much about what she said, as we don't know about what she said. Its all just guesswork outside of 'word of mouth'. The Trump side should have a legitimate strategy made up incase they are total nothing burgers and she does release them, because then that leaves him in a very vunerable spot.


we have a pretty good idea of what she said from second hand accounts, and we know it would be damaging enough to her she hasn't released it even when getting roasted in a primary on issues of trust and transparency.
She sang the praises of wall street and told them they were the ones to fix, and not cause, the economic meltdown, and went on at great length lauding them.

I'm sure somewhere in there would be a sound byte or at least quotation on paper that would cement her as the big money shill she is.
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May 12 2016 11:25am
Quote (ThatAlex @ May 12 2016 01:21pm)
Her transcripts have been a subject of great discussion and media speculation. If there's nothing damning in there then she should have no problem releasing them. If she wants to be the leader of our nation and we have questions about her past, then we have every right to criticize her if she doesn't answer them.

She also has every right to not release the transcripts, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't criticize it. It's sketchy as hell.


...and so what ? Everything that you post about HRC is seen through the jaundiced eyes of a Sanders supporter . I'm am not a Hillary fan by a long shot but I am also not a fan of blatant gossip for political advantage .
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May 12 2016 11:27am
Quote (Goomshill @ May 12 2016 12:25pm)
we have a pretty good idea of what she said from second hand accounts, and we know it would be damaging enough to her she hasn't released it even when getting roasted in a primary on issues of trust and transparency.
She sang the praises of wall street and told them they were the ones to fix, and not cause, the economic meltdown, and went on at great length lauding them.

I'm sure somewhere in there would be a sound byte or at least quotation on paper that would cement her as the big money shill she is.


While I hope what you're saying is true, because it helps out my candidate, the simple truth is still that we don't know for certain. Imo we shouldn't necessarily bank on it and Trump/His supports should prepare for worst case type of situation, where she uses releasing them strategically to undermine his arguments.
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May 12 2016 11:27am
Quote (Goomshill @ May 12 2016 09:41am)
The worst is sites like politifact giving blatantly anti-trump bias when he makes claims like Hilary starting the birther movement. She did, everyone knows it, but they call it 'false' because you cant prove it was hillary and not her campaign and it wasnt official. Apparently when liberals do whisper campaigns they can wash their hands of it, but when a republican like GWB says mccain fathered a black bastard baby we can crucify him for it.

Trump says enough wrong things not to try to condemn him for thr truth


This 100%, for the life of me i cant understand why so many flawed arguments are used ad nauseum against Trump.

"He barely made more than S&P with his inheritance"

"hillary started the birther movement"

etc

The fucking guy is calling for war crimes and insisting he will persuade the military to carry out illegal orders, calling for waterboarding and "much worse", and is blatantly risking our trade and diplomatic relationship with Mexico and the Middle east. But hey lets focus on what % returns he made compared to the index and whether or not his rug is real.
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May 12 2016 11:28am
Quote (ThatAlex @ May 12 2016 09:21am)
Her transcripts have been a subject of great discussion and media speculation. If there's nothing damning in there then she should have no problem releasing them. If she wants to be the leader of our nation and we have questions about her past, then we have every right to criticize her if she doesn't answer them.

She also has every right to not release the transcripts, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't criticize it. It's sketchy as hell.



I'm not arguing that it's good strategy, I'm arguing that it's sketchy. The American people have asked to see what is in them and she refuses. She has every right to do that, but we have every right to criticize her for her secrecy.

I'm asking you to step aside from your support of Hillary for a second and just examine her and her history. There are so many scandals and secrets it's crazy. And they all aren't some big, right-wing conspiracy that holds her to a different standard based on her gender. Hillary Clinton is untrustworthy.

And this isn't a competition between Trump and Hillary to see who can be more secretive about their financial pasts. I imagine Trump will release his tax return in due time. I doubt Hillary ever releases those transcripts. That's fine. People are going to keep hounding her about it and bringing up either until she does release them or the election is over.

Bottom line is that she doesn't have to release the information if she doesn't want to, but we have every right to criticize her for that and question it, whether it is good strategy or not.


Voting for Hillary over Trump (if it comes to that) doesn't make me some sort of Clinton enthusiast

I look at this all objectively as I am not excited about any of these jerkoffs.

You drank the kool-aid and your leader let you down by not providing anything other than typical Republican attacks and that is why he lost
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May 12 2016 11:32am
Quote (Beowulf @ May 12 2016 06:28pm)
Voting for Hillary over Trump (if it comes to that) doesn't make me some sort of Clinton enthusiast

I look at this all objectively as I am not excited about any of these jerkoffs.

You drank the kool-aid and your leader let you down by not providing anything other than typical Republican attacks and that is why he lost


if he led a perfect campaign he would have still lost
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