1. Provide me with any "reasonable source".

2. The Ukrainians say they are being attacked by the separatists, the separatists say that they're being attacked by Ukraine.

3. Ukrainian forces are moving to where they expect an attack to come.

4. Explain why Ukraine is going to attack a vastly superior adversary when they received guarantees from the West that no assistance is coming, and which, in your own words (see below), it will clearly lead to the end of Ukraine as an independent state, and likely the deaths of all involved.



You've ignored this, by the way. I'm waiting for a response.

Russia is literally following the playbook they used in the 2008 war with Georgia and the 2014 annexation of Crimea and Chopstickz is SHOCKED that someone would think Russia is the aggressor

Chop, if Ukraine is such an imminent threat that they need to evacuate separatist regions ASAP why record the video two days ago and release it now? Shouldnt if have gone out immediately if there was a real threat?

This post was edited by Sioux on Feb 18 2022 02:59pm

Anyone ever watch Canadian Bacon?

Fun fact - in 2008, Georgia initiated hostilities first by killing a few dozen Russian peacekeeping soldiers with an unprovoked artillery strike, after being armed and egged on to attack by NATO. It was only after this incident that Russia used military force, in response to a direct attack on their armed forces.

If there were an attack by Russia against US soldiers that killed 30 men in a single airstrike, you bet your ass there would be some kind of US military response - the internal domestic pressure to respond alone would be massive.

So you're right - the same playbook is being followed. Initiate hostilities, attack and kill people, then blame Russia when they respond to blatant aggression against them.

About the video, I didn't respond earlier because it's stupid. So the video was recorded two days before being uploaded. So what? You think that means anything important? No, it doesn't.

You think 700 thousand people are being evacuated from Donbass for fun? You think they would do that just for propaganda? Please. At any rate, the Ukrainian army has not begun their offensive yet, but the situation has reached a critical enough stage that it appears to be imminent and people are panicking. As of right now there is a ~20km long line of civilian cars leaving Donbass.

It could take a few days or weeks for them to break-through the frontline and directly threaten Donetsk/Luhansk. That's assuming they breakthrough and the defenses fail - a big assumption. Nevertheless, it's the wiser choice to evacuate - nobody knows how the situation will unfold and it's far better for them to assume the worst than be killed off. Any deaths of DPR/LPR civilians will either be ignored or blamed on Russia, so, it's better for them to leave the area.

Russia will face huge internal pressure to respond to the Ukrainian military offensive against Donbass. The Russian people are pissed off due to what they see as double-sided hypocrisy and racism against Russian-speaking citizens that are under threat of being massacred by the Ukrainian army. They are demanding action.

The only party that could put a stop to this is Ukraine itself. All they need to do is stop shelling Donbass and call off any potential offensive operation. But right now all signs point to the opposite and on top of that they are being pressured by Biden's admin to attack, who will look pretty dumb if nothing happens next week. Unfortunately Biden needs this war to help with his sagging approval ratings, especially with the mid-terms coming up.

Are you Michael Flynn?

I didn't ignore anything. Check the last post on page 28 for a response to your ridiculous claim about Ukraine's supposed economic prosperity in comparison to Russia. Hahaha, hilarious that you'd really believe it, honestly.

Ukraine isn't attacking Russia directly. They are attacking the DPR and LPR republics representing the breakaway region of Eastern Ukraine, where the people there did not accept the coup that took place in Kiev and established their own self-rule. This region is defended only by a volunteer militia comprised primarily of local volunteer fighters and some volunteers from abroad that took a stance against fascism. These forces are insufficient to invade Ukraine proper and although stand a solid chance of self-defense, may not be able to hold the line if Ukraine launches a full-scale attack assisted by US and NATO military advisors, using all the weapons that have been provided to them by the US and NATO in recent months.

However, they do so knowing that it might force Russia to get involved - which is what Biden wants and needs to justify a massive sanctions package and get rid of Nordstream 2, which they consider a "threat" to US hegemony over Europe. This is why it's a suicidal move - Russia is unlikely to tolerate continued aggression, which they now openly call genocide, against ethnic Russian and Russian speaking civilians that inhabit Donetsk and Luhansk, as well as the surrounding countryside and villages.

At any rate, it's clear that once Ukraine's offensive begins, you fully intend to completely ignore it. And then when Russia responds to Ukraine's aggression, I've no doubt you will join the chorus of ignorant and uninformed voices shedding their crocodile tears about how horrible and evil and aggressive Russia is towards the poor Ukrainian people, even though, just like 2008 in Georgia, they are the ones initiating said aggression and they are clearly the ones throwing the first punch by attacking Donbass.

You mean the guy who was arrested on trumped up charges invented by the corrupt FBI that were caught setting up an entrapment scheme to hurt Trump's presidency? And who Trump had to pardon because some hack activist judge refused to drop the charges even after the FBI was exposed as committing multiple felonies to accuse him, destroying their own case against him?

LOL - not exactly a great example to use, buddy.

Anyway, back to the topic at hand.

Ukraine has stepped up shelling with 120mm heavy mortars:

Gleb Bazov
@gbazov
·
2m
#DONBASS—#Ukraine|ian forces currently engaged in heavy (120mm mortar at least) bombardment of key #DPR militia defence positions near #Gorlovka, in #Zaitsevo settlement—in an attempt to destabilize defenses and shake-out the defenders. #Donetsk


Also, a surface to surface ballistic missile attack was reported yesterday, having apparently been fired by the Ukrainian army against Donbass.

Not exactly the actions of people who intend to de-escalate tensions and follow the terms of the Minsk agreements they signed.

Can't wait to see how when Ukraine launches their ground operation that the usual suspects will somehow find a way to spin it in their favor. Will they just ignore it completely, pretend it's not happening or will they just blame Russia? Guess we'll find out soon.

How can Ukraine attack themselves? Sounds like standard military drills to me.

Imagine thinking that the Ukrainians are going to attack Russia. Ukraine will not attack a single Russian on Russian soil. Any Russian on Ukrainian soil can just go home.

Other than that I personally have been massively gaslighted and lied to about every war America wanted to be involved in so I don't believe anything I see about Ukraine right now.

This post was edited by Skinned on Feb 18 2022 04:36pm

lol. Weird how all these countries that control territories Russia wants keep randomly shooting at Russian troops after Russia has amassed an invasion force on the border.