99% of the problem with HRC's platform was HRC. she was a walking contradiction on race and women's rights. having fucked over Bill's accusers and also spearheaded the "Super Predator" anti-black male CJ reforms.

you can't transfer over those problems to Harris, even if you may be right about the veracity of her campaign against Trump. The platform may be problematic, but it's far from causal to HRC losing. If anything she was the status-quo of the same platform Obama cleaned up with.

Electorally if Trump loses any of the south he may be sunk. A black woman running on a pro-cj reform and typical SJW racial talking points might be a very scary thing for Trump 2020. Florida with it's felon vote might have gone from middle purple to nearly blue in POTUS elections. 2020 will be interesting if for no other reason than to see how the change in Florida effects the state's national allegiance.

if i could bet in vegas on ads asking seniors with part time residency in Florida to cast their votes there to outweigh "dangerous felons" i'd slap down $10k right now.

This post was edited by thesnipa on Jan 24 2019 12:34pm

platform is one thing, but the campaign is another
HRC's campaign was just incompetently run. The echo chamber of yes-women she had leading her to be out of touch with the public and focus on the true believers can't be chocked up solely as the hubris of someone who 'knew' she was going to win and just wanted to maximize turnout and flip texas to get the biggest possible win. The fact they were all too happy to run a win-at-all-costs dirty campaign pulling out all the stops shows they took their battle seriously, but the fact they ran a poor emulation of karl rove and attacked the weakness showed their incompetence.

If the question is whether the 2020 democratic candidate would learn from the 2016 race's mistakes, well then everything we've seen since then has been a doubling down from the DNC and there's no reason to think they're about to flip around.

You're making a good point about Florida, that's really scary for Republicans. However, I dont think that other southern states like Georgia or Arizona are "ripe for the picking" yet. If a black Democrat runs on a platform of CJ reform and racial SJW stuff, this will trigger a huge turnout from white voters in southern states. They are still the majority in those states, and black turnout just wont exceed white turnout in such an election.

I also disagree with what you're saying about the platform: yes, Obama wiped the floor with this platform, but he was also the best campaigner of the last 50 or so years. in 2008, he was super fresh, everyone was optimistic about him. in 2012, he had already lost half the country, and won a sharply polarized race because his coalition was larger than Romney's and also because Romney was an uninspiring candidate who really couldnt boost the turnout of his coalition beyond the usual level.

In 2016, this platform had been debunked, and it was a big mistake by Clinton to, first, run as a status quo candidate without anything fresh, and second, to not see that Obama's campaign was tailored to him and was standing and falling with "his magic".
Do you really think this same platform will be any fresher if Harris runs on it again in 2020? Do you really think Harris can replicate Obama's magic, despite not having his charisma and being a significantly worse talker than him?

im convinced that 90% of the reason HRC's message of "fixing america one microagression at a time" fell on so many deaf ears was the rank hypocrisy. she's an abuser and a nasty woman. being told what to do and say and think by such a creature is unpalatable.

people want to point to the SJW movement as a failed platform on arrival, it's not, it just needs the right person to convince centrists that it wont be disastrous. HRC wasn't that bitch and she never will be. She's an authoritarian hardass hawk, acting like she wasn't in 2016 lost her more votes than calling Trump a racist or sexist.



on this im not saying the platform is neutral, im saying that it's not a disqualifying platform.

think of a spectrum from David Duke running on literal re-segregation on one end and Meek Milktoast Jimmy Carter on the other.

the current SJW platform is a lot closer to center than Duke and most GOP people talk about it like it's not. There are no doubt extremists, just not on the presidential ticket.



that's a hard maybe from me. lots of incalculable intangibles, blackness, non-abuser woman, fresh new person with a lot shorter record of service, etc.

harris has more parallels with Obama than HRC, imo.

This post was edited by thesnipa on Jan 24 2019 12:58pm

Donald Shipley going through Phillips' military record.

I think that's the main point where we disagree. From the emphasis on identity politics to the past record as a hawk (as a prosecutor in SF, Harris was considered a hawk, at least by the standards of SF), Harris reminds me more of Clinton than Obama. Not saying that I'm right and you're wrong, btw, it's just how I see it.

And let's also not forget that the times have changed. In 2008, there was still hope on both sides that the country could be united and that the divisions could be healed. Obama's 2008 campaign very successfully tapped into this hope. At least since the 2016 campaign, these hopes have been shattered, it's all-out culture war with both sides playing for a comprehensive, crushing victory over the other side. The sentiment that "Trump, despite all his flaws and shortcomings, is the only thing standing between us and total and utter defeat of everything we believe in" is extremely powerful, and a candidate like Harris with a platform like the one she seems to run on will trigger it.

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Jan 24 2019 01:08pm

People who believe this should be institutionalized.



Great photoshop skills.

This post was edited by IceMage on Jan 24 2019 02:09pm

Dunno i saw video footage of those kids harassing girls, so seems like they were in fact shitty people.

she's black tho.

i find it funny that so many people like to highlight the idiocy of identity politics then ignore how strong those identities are.

look at 2016, "white woman" became a label for "trump voter because of what husband wants". so clearly race means more than sex in the identity politics hierarchy.

I know that America is getting woke to the woman's struggle in society but blackness is still a far more powerful beacon. its not even close. if you dont live in america i can understand not getting that tho, race in america is a "you had to be there" thing.

for the record we clearly disagree on platform by a wide margin. i say platform doesnt matter she's black, you say "but but but her platform". that's an impasse, and for that reason, im out.

This post was edited by thesnipa on Jan 24 2019 02:12pm