stop lying so shamelessly, marcel. i have repeatedly stated that hamas needs to be eliminated. your personal attacks and racist innuendos don't make up for your blatant lack of actual arguments.

iran, for example, is infinitely more powerful, wealthier, and better equipped than the palestinians, and has threatened israel with "extinction" countless times. yet for some mysterious reason (israel having nukes, the most advanced military in the middle east, and unconditional US support) they never actually do anything, except funding cowardly terrorist attacks on civilians.

yet apartheid proponents like you are trying to tell everyone that israel ending its illegal occupation of the destitute palestinian people, half of which are children (!), would somehow be and existential threat to israel?!
do you genuinely not realise how obviously absurd that claim is, how flimsy of an excuse that is in order to "justify" the brutal oppression and violations of human rights? do you genuinely not realise how dumb that sounds to anyone even remotely familiar with the situation - especially if you take into account that they already agree about the current radical leaders having to go first?

so you actually wished death upon another forum member for disagreeing with you? i'm glad there are no radical extremists on israel's side. so "civilised"...

that said, if you're serious, you also just wished "death" upon your own prime minister, who not only actively supported hamas, but also israeli terrorists who murdered journalists, children, protesters, who tortured civilians, bulldozed homes and sealed wells... but for some reason i suspect you don't mean THOSE kinds of terrorists and terrorist supporters when you say "all"...

day 12 now, and zero plans on how to defeat and eliminate Hamas that dont involve gazan civilian casualties.

honestly, i havent even heard any #FREEPALESTINE people try and offer an answer. though they're quick to condemn Hamas, agree Hamas needs to be destroyed, etc. No plans tho, just "not what IDF is doing, even if what they're doing isn't what we think they're doing because it turns out that hospital wasnt them, and they didnt roll in in 24 hours like we thought, and they havent bombed it to dust, and and and and and, yeah ive got nothing".

no plans, just nay-saying.

If you invoke and try to understand the pitfalls associated with historical precedents of neutering dissenting (Muslim) regions we can learn a lot from the likes of Singapore, Russia, USSR, China, India and Yugoslavia. If only there would be political will to compromise on both sides.

The burden of making the first step towards normalization lies on the shoulders of the more powerful and wiser part. Bombing has proven again and again to only cause harm and suffering. The intrinsic motivation of the other side has to be changed to fix this once and for all - and bombing people from medieval age back to stone age cannot be viewed as long-term solution.

I disagree in that respect with Gooms assessment that eg social policy and more inclusive environment is intrinsically bad as we have example of eg Tatarstan in Russia which was a fierce Muslim majority region that got taken over and integrated into Russian Empire and then the USSR so well that they did not leave Russia when USSR collapsed. You could argue that the story of humiliating and bloody Chechen Wars of the 90s and how that conflict was solved resonates a lot with the plight of Gaza sector and what should be done to promote stability in the region.

when we are delivering money to the gaza strip, than you show it as our prime minister supported hamas? Lol

keep spreading lies about my country.

fact is: we're the most moral and humanic army in the world.

This post was edited by NiRo_O on Oct 19 2023 07:01am

Last 200+pages of this thread are basically that.

>We agree Hamas bad but here's a list of 200 reasons why Israel can't do anything otherwise genocide


They can't even try to move civilians to the south for example simply to try and isolate the perps in the north, without immediate calls of war crimes because you can't cut off electricity, water, w.e. I don't know what the solution is but it's obvious that really there's only two overarching ones. Do something or do nothing. They can't do nothing, just like we couldn't do nothing after 9/11.

gonna take a while

hopefully our goverment wont back down this time till hamas is no longer exist

There are definitely options but it requires cooler heads and good faith actors

That comedian interview duff posted main point that went unaddressed is a valid one which was - yes Hamas is evil and has to go, if only we had a chasm for what this scenario would look like, oh I bring you West Bank

If you’re a good faith actor on a two party solution (unrealistic as it is, have to assume this is the starting point because every government including Israel and the US are using this as base case) then you need to start dialogue with the Palestinian party open for peace - PA /West Bank.

Encourage every civilian who is staying in Gaza that the future is PA and here’s cash for ratting on Hamas.

PA also on board saying we are on the path and goal for a better life for Palestinian people

Use PA as a reason why you’re allowing aid to Palestinians in Gaza which will also catalyze people ratting on Hamas

You have a society of half 18 year olds who are pissed off. We should all remember what it was like to be 18 and is anger or reason the default emotion

Your options are kill ‘em or change the thought process

Nothing happens without US playing an integral role in this mediation with Israel and neighboring Arab nations. Biden really has to turn saudi first and make this a US, Israel, Saudi mission and then Egypt and Jordan will in line with Saudi. If Saudi and U.S. relations deteriorate then truly the world is setup for further loss because there will be longer lasting repercussions than just Gaza

We are not Allies with Japan because we bombed and left. Which has been the case in gaza for as long as we have been alive

This post was edited by Bazi on Oct 19 2023 07:14am

I don't disagree that this post rings true on the question "how do we improve Gaza". but it does literally nothing to answer "how do we defeat Hamas".

and there we have our crux. while hamas rules gaza cannot be fixed. there is no surgical strike plan to defeat hamas. hamas is smoke and shadow.



this just leads me to my thoughts, full clear of the country, full occupation of Gaza by IDF forces for the foreseeable future. full on lockdown. that's what we did with japan, that's how we rebuilt germany, and we tried and failed in Iraq.

and when the bombs stop dropping, and "300 killed today in strikes" turns to "20 today killed in skirmishes" the #FREEPALESTINE crowd will call the occupation illegal, apartheid, slavery, genocide. and everything else.

damned if u do, damned if u dont. so Israel must kill thousands of their own people in the invasion, reenter a country they've not be in 15 years.

This post was edited by thesnipa on Oct 19 2023 07:20am

in german we say "wash my fur, but dont get me wet" for stuff like that

its the same in other discussions, they say one thing, but if you actually move to do something they are like NOOOOOOOOOOO



my daily dose of hamas propaganda and dodging, amen

listen sweetheart, you can hide behind emotional rants and phrases like "illegal occupation" all you want

it has nothing to do with the reality on the ground

and that reality is that israel is fighting nonstop against a holocaust 2.0

hamas has overwhelming support and fighting them without collateral damagebis literally impossible

its tough, especially for innocent children, but its the truth

they can thank their parents for being radical, antisemite trash

p.s: funny alleged "genocide" over there when the population is exploding lmao

looks like they got enough resources for that