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Mar 11 2018 07:36am
Quote (Knoppie @ Mar 11 2018 07:15am)
Coal is easily minded more if the need arises. So that's not a plausible reason for the situation to change.



The largest coal seams appropriate for steel making are underground in the US. By now, 2018 they are very deep underground.
My reason for mentioning coal was that it will create a LOT of jobs, that were lost when the steel mills were shut down. These are very large mines.


Anyways, here's some stuff to read...




Quote
Coal mining
See also: Environmental justice and coal mining in Appalachia
Coal company houses in Jenkins, Kentucky, photographed by Ben Shahn in 1935

Coal mining is the industry most frequently associated with the region in outsiders' minds,[62][63] due in part to the fact that the region once produced two-thirds of the nation's coal. At present, however, the mining industry employs just 2% of the Appalachian workforce. The region's vast coalfield covers 63,000 square miles (160,000 km2) between northern Pennsylvania and central Alabama, mostly along the Cumberland Plateau and Allegheny Plateau regions. Most mining activity has been concentrated in eastern Kentucky, southwestern Virginia, West Virginia, and western Pennsylvania, with smaller operations in western Maryland, Tennessee and Alabama. The Pittsburgh coal seam, which has produced 13 billion tons of coal since the early 19th century, has been called the world's most valuable mineral deposit. There are over 60 major coal seams in West Virginia, and over 80 in eastern Kentucky. Most of the coal mined is bituminous, although significant anthracite deposits exist on the fringe of the region in central Pennsylvania.[64] About two-thirds of Appalachia's coal is produced by underground mining, the rest by surface mining.[65] Mountaintop removal, a form of surface mining, is a highly controversial mining practice in central Appalachia due to its negative impacts on the environment and health of local residents.[64]

In the late 19th century, the post-Civil War Industrial Revolution and the expansion of the nation's railroads brought a soaring demand for coal, and mining operations expanded rapidly across Appalachia. Hundreds of thousands of workers poured into the region from across the United States and from overseas, essentially overhauling the cultural makeup of eastern Kentucky, West Virginia, and western Pennsylvania. Mining corporations gained considerable influence in state and municipal governments, especially as they often owned the entire towns in which the miners lived. The mining industry was vulnerable to economic downturns, however, and booms and busts were frequent, with major booms occurring during World War I and II, and the worst bust occurring during the Great Depression. The Appalachian mining industry also saw some of the nation's bloodiest labor strife between the 1890s and the 1930s. Mining-related injuries and deaths were not uncommon, and ailments such as black lung disease afflicted miners throughout the 20th century. After World War II, innovations in mechanization (such as longwall mining) and competition from oil and natural gas led to a decline in the region's mining operations.[64] Environmental restrictions, such as those placed on high-sulfur coal in the 1980s, brought further mine closures. While with annual earnings of $55,000, Appalachian miners make more than most other local workers, Appalachian coal mining employed just under 50,000 in 2004.[66][67]

Coal mining has made a comeback in some regions in the early 21st century because of the increased prominence of Consol Energy, based in Pittsburgh. The Quecreek Mine rescue in 2002 and continuing mine subsidence problems in abandoned coal mines in western Pennsylvania as well as the Sago Mine disaster and Upper Big Branch Mine disaster in West Virginia and other regions have also been highlighted in recent times.[citation needed]
Manufacturing
Storage tanks at the Institute plant along the Kanawha River in West Virginia, photographed late 1930s/early 1940s

The manufacturing industry in Appalachia is rooted primarily in the ironworks and steelworks of early Pittsburgh and Birmingham, and in the textile mills that sprang up in North Carolina's Piedmont region in the mid-19th century. Factory construction increased greatly after the Civil War, and the region experienced a manufacturing boom between 1890 and 1930. This economic shift led to a mass migration from small farms and rural areas to large urban centers, causing the populations of cities such as Birmingham, Knoxville, Tennessee, and Asheville, North Carolina, to swell exponentially. Manufacturing in the region suffered a setback during the Great Depression, but recovered during World War II and peaked in the 1950s and 1960s. However, difficulties paying retiree benefits, environmental struggles, and the signing of the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA) in 1994 led to a decline in the region's manufacturing operations. Pittsburgh lost 44% of its factory jobs in the 1980s, and between 1970 and 2001, the number of apparel workers in the Appalachian region decreased from 250,000 to 83,000 and the number of textile workers decreased from 275,000 to 193,000.[68]

U.S. Steel, founded in Pittsburgh in 1901, was the world's first corporation with more than a billion dollars in initial capitalization.[68] Another Pittsburgh company, Alcoa, helped establish the nation's aluminum industry in the early 20th century, and has had a significant impact on the economies of western Pennsylvania and east Tennessee.[69] Union Carbide built the world's first petrochemical plant in Clendenin, West Virginia, in 1920, and in subsequent years the Kanawha Valley became known as the "Chemical Capital of the World".[70] Eastman Chemical, also established in 1920, is Tennessee's largest single employer. Companies such as Champion Fibre and Bowater established large pulp operations in Canton, North Carolina, and Greenville, South Carolina, respectively, although the former was dogged by battles with environmentalists throughout the 20th century.[71]




If you notice the bolded part above. Bringing steel and aluminum back to the US will create millions of jobs. This is also the reason we are stalled on NAFTA talks. NAFTA moved most of these industries from the US to Mexico and Canada.

If Trump pulls this off the amount of jobs created will be staggering.




/e Coal deposits in the US. The dark gray, is the "good stuff" for making steel. That's a LOT of jobs my friend.




This post was edited by Ghot on Mar 11 2018 07:49am
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Mar 11 2018 08:01am
Quote (Ghot @ Mar 11 2018 02:36pm)
Anyways, here's some stuff to read...


You're posting random bullshit to not have to agree with my point. Feels like talking to Card.

This post was edited by Knoppie on Mar 11 2018 08:01am
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Mar 11 2018 08:12am
Quote (Knoppie @ Mar 11 2018 09:01am)
You're posting random bullshit to not have to agree with my point. Feels like talking to Card.




LMAO, this is probably the most UN-random stuff I've ever posted.

STEEL and ALUMINUM industry in the US was born and raised in Pittsburgh, PA. The tariffs Trump has imposed will bring those industries back to the US, eventually.
Re-working NAFTA will do the same.

If you take these things separately, they seem...eh. But together, it's a master stroke by Trump.
Yesterday Trump was in Pittsburgh, putting his vouch behind the Republican candidates running atm. It all adds up. Trump's plan is starting to make a lot more sense.

6-7 months ago Trump was campaigning for coal, and most of the US was like ...wtf? Now, after the steel and aluminum tariffs, it makes a bit more sense.


But you can continue to be angry and hateful, that's ok. We'll just sit here and rake in the money. ^^
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Mar 11 2018 08:23am



This is the US forest map. the potential for producing matches is incredible ! So many ppl that can be given a job, this is amazing !

Now please remember that the matches industry has declined under the Bush administration, THE reason tariffs on steel didn't work then, because the factories were unable to light the fires !


......Yes, please take the 0.4 % decline in your economy and I'll take the 0.3% decline, np.

This post was edited by Knoppie on Mar 11 2018 08:24am
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Mar 11 2018 08:27am
Quote (Knoppie @ Mar 11 2018 09:23am)
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/bb/USA_National_Forests_Map.jpg/450px-USA_National_Forests_Map.jpg


This is the US forest map. the potential for producing matches is incredible ! So many ppl that can be given a job, this is amazing !

Now please remember that the matches industry has declined under the Bush administration, THE reason tariffs on steel didn't work then, because the factories were unable to light the fires !


Yes, please take the 0.4 % decline in your economy and I'll take the 0.3% decline, np.




You crack me up. Matches production did decline, because of BIC lighters.
Anyways, I'm glad you're so happy for the US at this point in time.
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Mar 11 2018 08:30am
Quote (Knoppie @ 11 Mar 2018 15:01)
You're posting random bullshit to not have to agree with my point. Feels like talking to Card.


card has more logic and less dodge
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Mar 11 2018 08:57am


...and Trump's approval rating is still going up. I bet that really pisses you off. :lol:
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Mar 11 2018 10:52am
Why did Steel and other manufacturing decline in the US in the first place? Because it's too expensive compared to countries like China so they have a competitive advantage. Tariffs will never address that fundamental issue, those jobs are gone for good. The only way to increase manufacturing these days is diversified and high quality products made by a skilled workforce, which the 3rd world can't replicate. Germany are the prime example of that policy in practice.
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Mar 11 2018 11:00am
Quote (dro94 @ Mar 11 2018 11:52am)
Why did Steel and other manufacturing decline in the US in the first place? Because it's too expensive compared to countries like China so they have a competitive advantage. Tariffs will never address that fundamental issue, those jobs are gone for good. The only way to increase manufacturing these days is diversified and high quality products made by a skilled workforce, which the 3rd world can't replicate. Germany are the prime example of that policy in practice.




They actually declined cause the US wanted them to. For agricultural reasons. These days I think we can do it without all the pollution.
When China steel started WE were sending China the iron ore.

/e The US has huge iron ore deposits. Minnesota has one of the largest, the Mesabi Range. But we have about 3-5 other very large ones.

This post was edited by Ghot on Mar 11 2018 11:03am
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Mar 11 2018 11:15am
Quote (Ghot @ Mar 11 2018 06:00pm)
They actually declined cause the US wanted them to. For agricultural reasons. These days I think we can do it without all the pollution.
When China steel started WE were sending China the iron ore.

/e The US has huge iron ore deposits. Minnesota has one of the largest, the Mesabi Range. But we have about 3-5 other very large ones.


You're not addressing the point, it can't be done competitively if they're producing low quality steel which most of it is
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