Again, I will typically agree with everything you say on this topic, so you dont have to direct this at me lol. but to be clear, China will get to that stage, over the next short-medium term, do you agree?

This post was edited by ferdia on Dec 14 2022 11:58am

That was sarcasm.

im not good with sarcasm sowy



when referencing things like the Nine Dash Line etc. there is no harm in elaborating, for the masses i mean. else i will when im bored.

This post was edited by ferdia on Dec 14 2022 12:01pm

I think when Global powers rise there will be conflicts there will be military bases build.
If I am American I will definitely do whatever I can within my power to wreck their plans but I am not.

We couldn't stop the Americans from building 850 bases all over the world due to to her economical and military clout.
I think it will not be possible to stop the Chinese in the future.

Thus the current Geo Political stance of the Americans and her " allies " to pull out all sorts of manner to stop the Chinese before they overtake the " West" dominance.

ideological opposition to china for me is simple, and revolves around a single issue, a future world wide govt and overrides regional sovereignty. at which time it will be driven by chinese or western ideology.

at some point in the future a UN-esque but on steroids governmental body will rule the earth. in order to make this happen it cannot operate like the UN security council. that organization is a loosely connected group of ideologically separated countries all tied by a single factor, having nuclear arms. and these ideological differences are the driving force behind the lack of direction and pragmatic action for the organization.

some time in the future, 150 or 200 years from now, we will have an Earth govt. countries will become states, states will become cities, and cities will have next to no power. at which time china can lot be allowed to steer the world govt's direction. we're on a dark path as a world, both chinese and western govts are not looking good, but the western direction is the only one that offers a slim chance of individual freedom and financial autonomy on that time scale.

The issue is simply that i think China is responsible so "How China has made America its enemy" is more appropriate. Issue is how you are formulating the debate.

Why and How

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_nationalism

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_police_overseas_service_stations



This post was edited by Meanwhile on Dec 14 2022 12:01pm

The South China Sea conflict is nothing new. Hell, I think I first posted about it, on here... approx. 6 years ago.
The whole world knows that this is actually happening.

The countries surrounding the South China Sea... want the US to intervene.
We don't really gain anything except the good will of these countries... by being there.

No not really, at least not yet. I am going to say this as a Singaporean

thx for posting, again, i broadly agree with all this. the only caveat i have is that "western" ideology and accepted norms are eroding and therefore its difficult to tell which ideology, long term, will provide the most social freedoms etc.



In retrospect I can agree with your framing (but I would challenge that its broadly the same thing). Ultimately China is on one side of the world and the US is on the other. China has not moved its military might directly to surround the US (they dont have that capability) but rather the US has moved its military might to surround China (because the US has that capability). If this is a direct response to an event carried out by China, then I would suggest we tease that out.

This post was edited by ferdia on Dec 14 2022 12:11pm

The US has zero imperialistic plans. We were asked to build those bases by countries that don't want to be over run by other countries that DO have imperialistic plans.
What countries have we tried to take over... to own.... ever?


That's the difference here. The US isn't trying to "dominate" anyone. But China... is. LOL

This post was edited by Ghot on Dec 14 2022 12:09pm