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Nov 10 2020 04:25pm
Quote (Budgeting @ Nov 10 2020 02:22pm)
uhm, drones strikes increased under trump and him and kushner are selling national security secrets to UAE to pay off kushner's debts.

did you not see they are trying to ram through another arms deal to UAE? 10 billion. This was the summation of those competely false "peace deals" negotiated by trump. wonder how much of this kushner is going to see and trump.


None of that speaks to my wars-perspective point. The United States didn't enter a new major war under Trump and that's huge.

It's an interesting position you're taking because you're essentially saying that either 1) There are no reasons at all to support Trump, or 2) There are no legit reasons. In either case I think that misses the very real and valid concerns Trump supporters/Republicans/Moderates have. Again, 71 million people don't vote for Trump without reason(s).

This post was edited by Handcuffs on Nov 10 2020 04:26pm
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Nov 10 2020 04:27pm
Quote (Jere @ 10 Nov 2020 22:52)
Republicans want to purge voter rolls regularly because the voter rolls have been proven inaccurate. I don't really see a problem with purging the rolls and re-registering, all I have to do to register is mail in a piece of paper.
I haven't seen any evidence of closed polling stations.
It's only considered undermining the publics confidence in elections if you hate Trump with some bias. It's actually saving the United States from a corrupt election that screams fraud in multiple places (ignoring that is wilful ignorance)
There is evidence to many of the sworn statements and TONS of other evidence I have shared here. It's also all over social media, but you have to get past all the "Trump is a fraud" crap to find it in between.


i can see you have done literally ZERO actual research on this, just brainlessly parrot whatever right wing talking point is out there, or whatever a registered sex offender from a different state tells you about pennsylvania in a "sworn statement", dragged in front of the camera by another creep... talk about ignorance...

Quote (Handcuffs @ 10 Nov 2020 22:44)
I think that there are a plethora of very valid reasons why people want a second term of Trump--which, in many ways, I read more as a second term of Republican leadership for some. There are definitely many right-wing folks who actively like Trump, and many more moderates who aren't super big on Trump as a person, but are in alignment with him by way of the two-party system and the limitations therein. Some reasons I can think of include:

- If you're from places like the Iron Range in Minnesota or any other areas of 'Coal Country', then Trump is the clear winner in terms of short-term necessity. The left does wonderfully about thinking of thinks at a systems-level, but sometimes does horribly at thinking at a local or individual level. When you have Democrats saying that they're either going to "put coal miners/mining companies out of business" or "ban fracking", it does little to build confidence and a feeling of support in people whose entire families and towns have been built around crude oil, coal, or fracking. Many people in these areas describe themselves as "single-issue voters", and understandably so. Trump is the candidate between the major 2 that at least says that he'll be bringing jobs back to coal country and cementing job security (Whether this happens in actuality is a different story though).

- Trump's foreign policy record from a war perspective is actually pretty good. The United States hasn't entered a new war (at least not a major one that I can think of) since he's been in office. This has been nice to see after more than a decade's worth of unnecessary wars.

- Trump made major in-roads with minority voters that Republicans haven't seen for several decades. This is largely, I guess, a result of push-back forming against the left. Again, the left thinks in a very systemic way at the expense of individual considerations. They've historically treated minorities as a monolith and as tokens, and people are understandably getting sick of that. Even though people will chalk it up as a poor joke, Biden's "If you vote for [Trump] then you ain't Black" is certainly a reflection of the sentiment many white people on the left have with regards to minorities.

- People are very concerned about the role and power of China in international politics, and Trump has taken a very strong, vocal opposition to China's authoritarian practices.

Edit: You don't have 71 million people vote for Trump without reason(s).


here's the thing though:

- coal jobs kept declining under trump, despite his generous promises back in 2016
- he did NOT bring the troops back home, almost started a new major war with iran just because he wants to destroy obama's legacy so badly, and he also escalated drone strikes that were already rampant under his predecessor
- he ballooned the deficit and gave major tax breaks to the rich and corporations
- his sometimes harsh / sometimes flattering rhetoric regarding china does not follow any coherent strategy or even concrete policy.

and this is not even addressing his major failing, which is the total mishandling of a pandemic, being the single largest source of anti-scientific misinformation worldwide, directly leading to tens of thousands of unnecessary deaths in america alone due to making mask and distancing a partisan issue...

i agree that millions of people didn't vote for him without reasons, but the 'reasonable / valid' sounding ones are easily debunked, while fear-mongering (about communism / socialism / antifa / the radical left) and bigotry (towards people of colour / muslims / jews / immigrants) remain the main factors when you look at his followers - not just the trump folk in this sub forum, but also his rallies, and in polls conducted amongst his supporters...
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Nov 10 2020 04:29pm
jere
bro
lemme tell you how this ends
biden is sworn in in January and you cling to the wreckage and any fleeting hope you can find that your guy is coming back
for 4 years
lot of us have been doing this for the last 4 years
it's miserable
don't do it
biden presidency isn't going to be the end of your world
mitch will obstruct anything and everything as is his way, and it will be a boring, get-nothing-done 4 years
even if dems win the runoffs, which they probably won't, someone like manchin will defect to stop anything too major from changing
enjoy 4 years of boredom
we all need it
just like
breathe
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Nov 10 2020 04:30pm
Quote (fender @ 10 Nov 2020 16:27)
i can see you have done literally ZERO actual research on this, just brainlessly parrot whatever right wing talking point is out there, or whatever a registered sex offender from a different state tells you about pennsylvania in a "sworn statement", dragged in front of the camera by another creep... talk about ignorance...



here's the thing though:

- coal jobs kept declining under trump, despite his generous promises back in 2016
- he did NOT bring the troops back home, almost started a new major war with iran just because he wants to destroy obama's legacy so badly, and he also escalated drone strikes that were already rampant under his predecessor
- he ballooned the deficit and gave major tax breaks to the rich and corporations
- his sometimes harsh / sometimes flattering rhetoric regarding china does not follow any coherent strategy or even concrete policy.

and this is not even addressing his major failing, which is the total mishandling of a pandemic, being the single largest source of anti-scientific misinformation worldwide, directly leading to tens of thousands of unnecessary deaths in america alone due to making mask and distancing a partisan issue...

i agree that millions of people didn't vote for him without reasons, but the 'reasonable / valid' sounding ones are easily debunked, while fear-mongering (about communism / socialism / antifa / the radical left) and bigotry (towards people of colour / muslims / jews / immigrants) remain the main factors when you look at his followers - not just the trump folk in this sub forum, but also his rallies, and in polls conducted amongst his supporters...


Yea, I've done no research and I'm parroting information. Lmk when you are raging and rioting cause all of it's true and you still just cant accept it.
You're acting like what the left says Donnie acts like...
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Nov 10 2020 04:30pm
Quote (excellence @ Nov 10 2020 03:50pm)
because pale lefties will be upset as usual but they will fully blame latin-american people and black people for their troubles this time


I've been informed that people of latin origin are officially white now due to their increased support of Trump. Please alter your language to reflect this in the future.
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Nov 10 2020 04:33pm
Quote (chemoshots @ 10 Nov 2020 16:29)
jere
bro
lemme tell you how this ends
biden is sworn in in January and you cling to the wreckage and any fleeting hope you can find that your guy is coming back
for 4 years
lot of us have been doing this for the last 4 years
it's miserable
don't do it
biden presidency isn't going to be the end of your world
mitch will obstruct anything and everything as is his way, and it will be a boring, get-nothing-done 4 years
even if dems win the runoffs, which they probably won't, someone like manchin will defect to stop anything too major from changing
enjoy 4 years of boredom
we all need it
just like
breathe


Could happen, but tbh I'm pretty sure that the fraud story got to big to cover it up.
Remember Biden is on camera saying he built the biggest and best fraud election agency in the history of the United States.
Funny how they aren't coming out and saying there is no fraud, that agency he created was actually the biggest fraud election group in our history.

Don't take my word for it though, just wait until a talking head you listen to says it. :)
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Nov 10 2020 04:37pm
Quote (Jere @ Nov 10 2020 04:01pm)
80% is pretty high based on the number of counties Trump won vs Biden.. but that's just another anomaly, nothing to see there.


Land doesn't vote. People do.
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Nov 10 2020 04:39pm
Quote (Surfpunk @ 10 Nov 2020 16:37)
Land doesn't vote. People do.


Yea, apparently the same people with fake names. Like I told someone earlier check out #MaidenGate on social media and you will see even more evidence of thousands of women realizing that someone requested and voted using their maiden names. You are completely ignoring stuff because of bias.
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Nov 10 2020 04:42pm
Quote (Jere @ Nov 10 2020 04:39pm)
Yea, apparently the same people with fake names. Like I told someone earlier check out #MaidenGate on social media and you will see even more evidence of thousands of women realizing that someone requested and voted using their maiden names. You are completely ignoring stuff because of bias.


https://www.reddit.com/r/OutOfTheLoop/comments/jrh1fl/whats_going_on_with_maidengate_on_twitter/
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Nov 10 2020 04:43pm
Quote (fender @ Nov 10 2020 02:27pm)
i can see you have done literally ZERO actual research on this, just brainlessly parrot whatever right wing talking point is out there, or whatever a registered sex offender from a different state tells you about pennsylvania in a "sworn statement", dragged in front of the camera by another creep... talk about ignorance...



here's the thing though:

- coal jobs kept declining under trump, despite his generous promises back in 2016
- he did NOT bring the troops back home, almost started a new major war with iran just because he wants to destroy obama's legacy so badly, and he also escalated drone strikes that were already rampant under his predecessor
- he ballooned the deficit and gave major tax breaks to the rich and corporations
- his sometimes harsh / sometimes flattering rhetoric regarding china does not follow any coherent strategy or even concrete policy.

and this is not even addressing his major failing, which is the total mishandling of a pandemic, being the single largest source of anti-scientific misinformation worldwide, directly leading to tens of thousands of unnecessary deaths in america alone due to making mask and distancing a partisan issue...

i agree that millions of people didn't vote for him without reasons, but the 'reasonable / valid' sounding ones are easily debunked, while fear-mongering (about communism / socialism / antifa / the radical left) and bigotry (towards people of colour / muslims / jews / immigrants) remain the main factors when you look at his followers - not just the trump folk in this sub forum, but also his rallies, and in polls conducted amongst his supporters...


Whether they're "debunked" or not doesn't really answer the question in the OP though. It doesn't really matter whether coal jobs end up coming back or not. All people can do is weight the two major choices forced upon us every 4 years and decide which one sounds more hopeful. The guy claiming to at least care about coal country and saying that he'll "open the mines" is a lot more promising than a candidate who says they're "going to a put a lot coal miners/companies out of business" or one who says that they're going to "ban fracking".

The piece on foreign policy is a whataboutism that still doesn't address the fact that the United States avoided a new major war throughout virtually all of Trump's campaign. Whether the "troops didn't come back home" or if "more drones were used" is largely irrelevant to this point.

The deficit isn't particularly relevant to most everyday Americans and their lives. They're more concerned with whether or not they have the personal means to support themselves and their families. One can criticize America's individualistic tendencies and certainly be justified in doing so, but again, these post-hoc criticisms and observations don't address the main question brought up in the OP.

His demeanor and manner of speech is also a positive in many people's eyes. They don't see him as a traditional politician and for them this is a strength of Trump's. He speaks in a more "real" way that many people resonate with, and this includes his rhetoric on China.
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