When I drop an apple, it's gonna hit the floor. Cause and effect.
When I'm a rich playboy type, and I win the presidential election, it's gonna piss people off. Cause and effect.

I see a lot of PaRDians that can't imagine that there might just be nothing at all to the accusations trump is fielding at the moment. That it just might be a witch hunt.

I see Trump accused of colluding with Russia to affect the election results in his favor. This makes me wonder why Putin would deign to collude with Trump, who might just tweet anything at any time. Trump is not exactly the person I would want in a risky deal with a super power.
From the other guy's (Putin's) point of view, it just seems like a very risky proposition.

If I was Putin and I wanted to collude with some high level politician in the US, I think I would pick some one with more political acumen than Trump was known for at the time. But that's just me.

This post was edited by Ghot on Jun 4 2018 09:51pm

Yeah why would Putin waste his time on the most powerful man in the world that can easily be controlled with ego stroking

If the collusion thing is true, then Trump wasn't the most powerful man in the world at the time. In fact, no one thought he was gonna win, yourself included.
It would seem to be a really stupid thing to pick the candidate that the whole world thought would lose.

/e I mean Putin could have picked Clinton who is easily stroked with a few million dollars, which is much less time consuming and relatively risk free. We already know the Clinton foundation scored $145 mill after the uranium One deal. A deal that looks really great for Russia, and really crappy for the US.

This post was edited by Ghot on Jun 4 2018 09:56pm

Why do people care if 'trump could pardon himself'?
Its a ridiculous question not just based on it being an implausible hypothetical. Its ridiculous also because of the very nature of what a pardon is: A reprieve for one person. What does it matter what happens to Donald Trump? All a pardon does is spare one person their punishment. A pardon doesn't rewrite a criminal statute, it doesn't set policy. It doesn't matter to me or you or anyone else whatsoever what personally happens to Trump. It matters what the fate of the country is, the politics.

Donald Trump could hypothetically launch a bunch of nukes tomorrow. He won't. We've given him the power thanks to the cold war and expansion of the executive. It matters a lot more if Trump turns the world into a burning cinder and annihilates humanity than whether he personally goes to prison. That's a distinction I made on day 1 after his election when he violated his campaign pledge and said he wouldn't 'lock her up'. Because who the fuck cares if Hillary goes to prison? Why should that matter. Its the greater geopolitical fallout that matters, and tearing the temple down to pointlessly try to crucify one woman would have been madness. And Trump vindicated me when it dropped his pretense with no delay and said he was just kidding all along, fuck the trump cult. He made the same calculation Gerald Ford made, the country didn't need to get dragged through the muck to go after one person, Nixon was already dead in the political sphere.

So tell me, why should I care if Trump could technically commit a crime, pardon himself, and then avoid prosecution? Because the check upon the executive is impeachment not criminal prosecution, and the fundamental political question of Trump's legitimacy as president and russiaburger scandal isn't moved an inch by whether or not he could hypothetically pardon himself even if something was proven. If it turned out he was really blowing Putin in a back alley in exchange for the help from spooky russian hackers, then he'd get immediately impeached and his political movement would implode, and any last minute pardon would be irrelevant, he'd be dead in the political sphere. And if nobody can find muh collusion, then its a stupid hypothetical because he'd never need to pardon himself. And if Mueller tried to ignore his scope and mandate of russian interference in the 2016 election and instead try to go on a fishing expedition for financial misdealings from the 1990s, then Trump would not be impeached, nor would he even get indicted because he can't be indicted, so he'd never pardon himself. And then Mueller would get ousted by the republicans. Lets hope Mueller isn't a partisan hack.

I doubt Trump knew much about what was happening around him

In fact more came out of this so far than I expected

But sometimes the slower horse wins and the gambler gets lucky

Strategy is an active choice in the modern age, not spontaneous. He could be either.

He would look better if he just shut up though

In fact, nobody thought Trump was going to win, Putin included
that's a major point in understanding the dynamics and motivations, because it explains well how Putin was interfering to hurt Hillary in tit-for-tat retaliation against her 2011 violations of sovereignty against him, but was not motivated by trying to 'help Trump'. And thats why the nuance of 'help Trump' vs 'hurt Hillary' is something that politically motivated actors in the IC and media keep spinning wildly. They aren't the same. If Putin just assumed Hillary was going to easily win anyway, then pulling down her pants during the 2016 election was his power play to rattle her cage and Trump wasn't even a real factor in his decision making.

Russia is currently crippled by sanctions. Keep dreaming

I care a lot more about the profiteering nepotism shoved in our faces on a daily basis than I do about goofy son #1 trying to jerk off Russians for dirt

IF Putin was betting on one of the horses, I would think he would choose Clinton. He already KNOWS she can be bought, and further that she can keep her mouth shut and can get away with it.
We also know that Trump gets upset and runs his mouth, when he shouldn't.

Further, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that a lot of folks would be pissed if Clinton lost. So Putin would realize that if Trump won, Trump would be fighting an uphill battle the whole way.
Not exactly the horse I would back if I was Putin and wanted leverage in the US or over the US.


/e




It's all about that 4D chess crap, doncha know.

This post was edited by Ghot on Jun 4 2018 10:12pm