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Mar 24 2020 01:39pm
Quote (fender @ Mar 24 2020 03:13pm)
so you acknowledge that he was downplaying the threat, and that those videos of him proving that are real, you just claim (without providing any specifics) that it's misleading because they didn't have like 20 full speeches in the video. i see. hard to make excuses for him while at the same time trying appear reasonable and not completely ignorant of facts i guess...

i gave you my response. quit trying to narrate my words.
i've watched every press conference since this has happened. (although i fell asleep during it yesterday)

"under control". this video narrates that every time he says this, he is claiming he has the "virus" under control. like he stored it in a bottle or something. a lot of theses phrases were referring to specific actions. and just because issues arise, if you are able to identify and remedy the situation. that proves control.
there's an example, i'm not going to pin-point every clip with a longer time-stamp. it's a video that favors the word "it" and tries to narrate what "it" means.

let me clarify what "i" had issues with. i've even stated it in real-time, i believe in this thread.
president Trump comparing the common flu deaths to the deaths from CoVid-19. we didn't have nearly enough data to compare the 2.
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Mar 24 2020 01:41pm
Quote (tagged4nothing @ Mar 24 2020 02:39pm)
i gave you my response. quit trying to narrate my words.
i've watched every press conference since this has happened. (although i fell asleep during it yesterday)

"under control". this video narrates that every time he says this, he is claiming he has the "virus" under control. like he stored it in a bottle or something. a lot of theses phrases were referring to specific actions. and just because issues arise, if you are able to identify and remedy the situation. that proves control.
there's an example, i'm not going to pin-point every clip with a longer time-stamp. it's a video that favors the word "it" and tries to narrate what "it" means.

let me clarify what "i" had issues with. i've even stated it in real-time, i believe in this thread.
president Trump comparing the common flu deaths to the deaths from CoVid-19. we didn't have nearly enough data to compare the 2.


if hypothetically a press conference had Trump say 237 "good" things and 12 "bad" things Fender would have zero issues with a montage video of the 12 with all 237 edited out. its really pointless to argue with him on this topic, or any other tbh.
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Mar 24 2020 01:41pm
Quote (thesnipa @ Mar 24 2020 03:32pm)
im never going to look at a liar potus and say "well they all lie, and we know they all lie, so its cool". fuck, that.


There's nothing we can do about in the immediate future (except perhaps protect ourselves by not listening and encouraging the people close to us to avoid listening).

And I agree "so its cool" is NOT an acceptable final conclusion on the situation. Instead, we should learn from this situation in hindsight and take action and force the creation of a new system where voters enforce accountability. We need media that translates the message into a usable form i.e. "when he says X what he really means is Y" but not with the intent to just parrot or flame the politician in question.

Quote (thesnipa @ Mar 24 2020 03:32pm)
My answer remains the same, i want the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. if it causes mass hysteria, so be it.


What structure of government do you suggest that humanity could create to facilitate such a means of communication? I don't think we've had one yet.


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Mar 24 2020 01:43pm
Quote (Kayeto @ Mar 24 2020 02:41pm)
There's nothing we can do about in the immediate future (except perhaps protect ourselves by not listening and encouraging the people close to us to avoid listening).

And I agree "so its cool" is NOT an acceptable final conclusion on the situation. Instead, we should learn from this situation in hindsight and take action and force the creation of a new system where voters enforce accountability. We need media that translates the message into a usable form i.e. "when he says X what he really means is Y" but not with the intent to just parrot or flame the politician in question.



What structure of government do you suggest that humanity could create to facilitate such a means of communication? I don't think we've had one yet.


the system doesnt matter, communism all the way to a libertarian utopia. it is up to the people to demand truth. the system just changes their response, violence in oppressive regimes voting out in democratic regimes.

i also dont expect it to happen overnight, but the internet and fact checking helps. as well as 24-7 media scrutiny, which i also hate at times. its chemotherapy, nasty to deal with but fighting the disease.
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Mar 24 2020 01:46pm
Roubini: Coronavirus economic damage is 'worse even than the Great Depression'


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Mar 24 2020 01:47pm
Quote (thesnipa @ Mar 24 2020 03:41pm)
if hypothetically a press conference had Trump say 237 "good" things and 12 "bad" things Fender would have zero issues with a montage video of the 12 with all 237 edited out. its really pointless to argue with him on this topic, or any other tbh.

i know, it's dis-heartening because i do have criticisms of President Trump that i wouldn't mind discussing.
but when it comes to speaking about President Trump. you give an inch and they take a mile. (which would be fine if that mile existed)

that video has some good example of things i wasn't fond of. but "most" of it is taken out of context which puts me in defense mode.
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Mar 24 2020 01:51pm
Quote (fender @ Mar 24 2020 02:24pm)
so not being a raging, name-calling kid is actual 'effort' to you? civility is not your nature, but a 'benefit'? well, i don't think i could insult you worse than you just did yourself there, even if i wanted to.

that said, you already sound like him: despite all the evidence to the contrary you keep insisting that your healthcare is "perfectly fine" and that you'll "do better than most" - the only thing missing is the "believe me"...


No, giving people thoughtful, careful responses = effort. Insulting you is effortless. Civility is my default state. I always respond to tone. You? You earn all of this.
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Mar 24 2020 01:53pm
Quote (Kayeto @ 24 Mar 2020 20:35)
The politicians haven't changed their behavior. Both sides are prioritizing their political rivalry over making the proper decisions to run the country. The debate over the stimulus proposals are just as childish as every other conflict they've had on less important issues.


you should really look up what 'false equivalence' is...

Quote (Kayeto @ 24 Mar 2020 20:26)
You keep trying to project positive sentiment toward Trump in my posts when in fact my words express only negativity toward him.


if THAT:

Quote (Kayeto @ 24 Mar 2020 19:58)
A politician in charge touting the narrative of "things are fine" is akin to a defense lawyer saying things that make his client look innocent. There's no grounds to criticize them for supporting a false narrative: they are just doing their job.

Responsibility lies on the viewer to understand the difference between "the words of a politician" and "useful information". Its not Trump's fault that he was born into a system in which his job was to say false things that support his administration's goal. Anyone else who has been elected would have been in the same position.

If you are mad that we live in a world where masses of people wrongly conflate "worlds of politicians" with "an attempt to provide reliable information", then where should that anger be directed? At the media for polarizing the narrative even more, when they could instead be translating it into something more rational? At the masses of people, for listening to the wrong media? At the generations of politicians who crafted the current system into what it is? At the generations of voters who refused enforce accountability on those politicians?


is not the most delusional and dishonest attempt to excuse and downplay trump's terrible response to the crisis, i don't know what it is...

so it's just 'the system' / 'just the world we live in' / 'everyone does it' / 'no grounds to criticise' / 'just doing his job' / 'responsibility on the viewer' / 'not trump's fault' / 'b-b-but the media'... where is that alleged 'negativity toward him' in that?




Quote (tagged4nothing @ 24 Mar 2020 20:39)
i gave you my response. quit trying to narrate my words.
i've watched every press conference since this has happened. (although i fell asleep during it yesterday)

"under control". this video narrates that every time he says this, he is claiming he has the "virus" under control. like he stored it in a bottle or something. a lot of theses phrases were referring to specific actions. and just because issues arise, if you are able to identify and remedy the situation. that proves control.
there's an example, i'm not going to pin-point every clip with a longer time-stamp. it's a video that favors the word "it" and tries to narrate what "it" means.

let me clarify what "i" had issues with. i've even stated it in real-time, i believe in this thread.
president Trump comparing the common flu deaths to the deaths from CoVid-19. we didn't have nearly enough data to compare the 2.


i'm not trying to 'narrate your words', i'm trying to figure out why a video illustrating how trump repeatedly mislead the public about the severity of this crisis triggered you so badly.
i was trying to find out if there's any substance to your criticism, or if you were just mad that it makes trump look bad by simply showing video clips of him saying wrong and stupid stuff to suggest the threat is much smaller than he could have known it was, if he listened to experts and scientists.

This post was edited by fender on Mar 24 2020 01:56pm
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Mar 24 2020 01:54pm
Quote (tagged4nothing @ Mar 24 2020 02:47pm)
i know, it's dis-heartening because i do have criticisms of President Trump that i wouldn't mind discussing.
but when it comes to speaking about President Trump. you give an inch and they take a mile. (which would be fine if that mile existed)

that video has some good example of things i wasn't fond of. but "most" of it is taken out of context which puts me in defense mode.


yup, living in such a polarized world really does suck sometimes.
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Mar 24 2020 01:57pm
Yes, it's actually real.

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