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Apr 27 2018 05:03pm
Quote (duffman316 @ 27 Apr 2018 12:29)


going to jail can be good for a homeless man depending on where hes sent
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Apr 27 2018 07:35pm
Quote (Thor123422 @ 27 Apr 2018 23:54)
Those are pretty awful comparisons for this purpose.

Will they ever give up the idea of becoming a nuclear power? Their agreement to the Iran deal says they are fine with it if it ensures their continued survival.

They also have elements of a Democracy even if their president shares power with the religious head of the country.

They also don't have a culture embargo, and have a citizenry that is very upset when they don't get western products, so as a country they can be swayed much easier than North Korea.



You need to do more reading on Iran before we can even have this conversation because there are A LOT of reasons why they aren't comparable. Most notably in that they aren't a dictatorship above the control of the citizenry by virtue of cult-like leadership tactics.



if you seriously think the president of iran shares any powers with the supreme leader, you are mistaken. the president can shape the day-to-day politics and make the minor, unimportant decisions. but the supreme leader has the final and unilateral say on all important matters.

the only reason why the supreme leader and the 6 religious representatives on the 12-person guardian council dont have unlimited power is that the majority of the people is against the religious hardliners and they dont want to risk widespread riots.

yes, the iranian constitution gives the people more influence on minor policy details than in NK. yes, the iranian people is less isolated, more knowledgable of the world outside, more educated and probably more liberal and less fanatic than the people of NK.
and yes, for these reasons, I dont think that one can compare these two cases exactly. yes, for these reasons, I believe that there is more hope for progress and a positive development in iran than in NK.

however, all of this doesnt change the fact that the points which thesnipa mentioned equally apply to both NK and Iran:

- their leadership cant be trusted. (as mentioned above, the relatively liberal president is NOT the leader of iran!)
- the only objectively 'good' deal would be them stepping down. every other deal is varying degrees of 'bad'.
- "Everything else is just them shaking us down for money while they laugh in back rooms and maintain their weapons."

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Apr 27 2018 07:36pm
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Apr 27 2018 07:46pm
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Apr 27 2018 07:35pm)
and yes, for these reasons, I dont think that one can compare these two cases exactly. yes, for these reasons, I believe that there is more hope for progress and a positive development in iran than in NK.



This is the most important difference, as to why a deal with Iran is fundamentally different than a deal with NK. A NK rebellion by the people is a fundamentally more difficult prospect than a rebellion by the people of Iran. As a result we can shape their policy with sanctions much easier than we can NK.

I'm not talking about the people's direct power in their constitution, but the fact that they have a much more interconnected and westernized population that can place political pressure on their leadership even if they aren't directed elected.



Whether or not you can trust the leadership is a moot point when the deal we made allows inspections on a few weeks notice, which is not enough time for any country to hide a massive project like making a nuclear bomb.

The best deal might be them stepping down, but if your only standard of a "good deal" is to get everything you want no matter how unreasonable, then I don't know what you tell you except that you aren't using a reasonable metric.

"them shaking us down for money while they maintain their weapons". This, again, can just be chalked up to your lack of knowledge about the deal and the country. Sorry, but you need to do more reading before we can actually have an informed discussion on this topic.
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Apr 27 2018 07:54pm
Quote (Thor123422 @ 28 Apr 2018 03:46)
Sorry, but you need to do more reading before we can actually have an informed discussion on this topic.


was about to say the same to you, lol!

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Apr 27 2018 07:54pm
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Apr 27 2018 07:57pm
Quote (duffman316 @ 27 Apr 2018 22:40)


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Apr 27 2018 09:00pm
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Apr 27 2018 09:31pm
Quote (MSX98 @ Apr 27 2018 10:00pm)



not bad
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Apr 27 2018 09:49pm


current year
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Apr 27 2018 10:13pm
Quote (cambovenzi @ Apr 27 2018 07:49pm)



>cant tell which word is more offensive
>the real current year starts here
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