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Jun 5 2010 09:41am
Quote (Handcuffs @ Jun 5 2010 09:33am)
No, the notion that the universe has always existed coincides with science in an abstract sense.

The notion of God, and of God having always existed etc. does not.


No it does not, to say something that is high in energy and low in entropy to have existed just like that without an input energy destroys all laws the law of physics.
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Jun 5 2010 09:43am
Quote (Cadet133 @ Jun 5 2010 03:41pm)
No it does not, to say something that is high in energy and low in entropy to have existed just like that without an input energy destroys all laws the law of physics.


Law of conservation of matter states that matter can neither be created nor destroyed, if I'm not mistaken.

If this is indeed the case, then it would make sense that the universe was never "created".

This post was edited by Handcuffs on Jun 5 2010 09:43am
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Jun 5 2010 10:53am
Quote (Handcuffs @ Jun 5 2010 09:43am)
Law of conservation of matter states that matter can neither be created nor destroyed, if I'm not mistaken.

If this is indeed the case, then it would make sense that the universe was never "created".


The law applies to within the realms of this universe only... Anything beyond the big bang is non applicable in today's physics
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Jun 5 2010 10:58am
Quote (Handcuffs @ Jun 5 2010 03:33pm)
No, the notion that the universe has always existed coincides with science in an abstract sense.

The notion of God, and of God having always existed etc. does not.


It doesn't coincide with logic. When you've solved the problems associated with transversing the infinite get back to me.
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Jun 5 2010 11:04am
Quote (bogie160 @ Jun 5 2010 04:58pm)
It doesn't coincide with logic. When you've solved the problems associated with transversing the infinite get back to me.


God doesn't coincide with logic. The idea that the universe was created is nothing more than an assumption.

Bolded: I'm not sure what you're gettting at.

This post was edited by Handcuffs on Jun 5 2010 11:10am
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Jun 5 2010 11:05am
Quote (Cadet133 @ Jun 5 2010 04:53pm)
The law applies to within the realms of this universe only... Anything beyond the big bang is non applicable in today's physics


When were we talking about anything beyond the Big Bang? Or even the Big Bang at all?
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Jun 5 2010 11:08am
Quote (Cadet133 @ Jun 5 2010 03:41pm)
No it does not, to say something that is high in energy and low in entropy to have existed just like that without an  input energy destroys all laws the law of physics.


There is no evidence of the construct called 'time' being there before the big bang. Therefore the universe has always existed.
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Jun 5 2010 07:32pm
Quote (balrog66 @ Jun 5 2010 11:08am)
There is no evidence of the construct called 'time' being there before the big bang. Therefore the universe has always existed.


See there you go again, why is it plausible for you to say the universe ALWAYS EXISTED but not Ok for a theist to say that there is a diety that always existed?
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Jun 5 2010 07:33pm
Quote (Cadet133 @ Jun 6 2010 11:32am)
See there you go again, why is it plausible for you to say the universe ALWAYS EXISTED but not Ok for a theist to say that there is a diety that always existed?


Because there is evidence for the universe and no evidence for a deity?
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Jun 5 2010 07:37pm
No there is no proof that the Universe ALWAYS EXISTED...
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