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Jun 3 2019 06:47pm
Quote (inkanddagger @ Jun 3 2019 04:53pm)
Post an example of what a formerly elected Democrat has said about this.






https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-congress-barr/u-s-house-to-vote-next-week-on-whether-to-find-barr-in-contempt-idUSKCN1T42V8

Quote
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The full U.S. House of Representatives will vote next week on whether to hold Attorney General William Barr in contempt for failing to comply with a subpoena seeking the full, unredacted report on Russian meddling in the 2016 election, House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer said on Monday.




https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-schiff/house-intelligence-chief-warns-spy-agencies-of-trump-politicization-idUSKCN1T12I4

Quote
Schiff criticized Trump for giving Attorney General William Barr “sweeping” powers to declassify or downgrade the secrecy of government reporting while conducting what the Justice Department is calling a “review” of “intelligence activities” related to the 2016 U.S. presidential election campaign.




On one hand the Dems want un-redacted, on the other hand they don't want un-redacted for the 2016 investigation. I'm seriously surprised you don't already know this.





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Jun 4 2019 02:26am
Firstly Yes, I finally awoke from my coma so thanks all who were worried (you know who you are!).

When Ed Snowden revealed the true depth of how deep and substantial the tendrils of the surveillance state extend, even though I was quite aware that they were actively engaging in surveillance against US citizens, I could never have fathomed how extensive it actually was. The most powerful weapon the government has ever concocted, that can be used against us and our fellow citizens, was fully revealed. Unfortunately, people such as myself (those who were indignant and outraged) occupied a rather small minority, most people didn’t understand and didn’t care. “These systems are there to look for terrorism, find terrorism, and stop terrorism, they would never be used against US citizens (unless they’re terrorists, lol!).” Fast forward to 2015, the Democrats are coming off an eight year run and will likely lose control of the executive branch, if history is any indication, but that’s just the natural ebb and flow of a democratic republic, amirite? Or… we could manipulate this extremely powerful and inconceivably massive deep-seated military-industrial-technological-surveillance abomination and weaponized it against, let’s say, the political opposition? All we have to do is pull some NSA queries on people in every campaign, get those persons unmasked, leak the info to the press with a nefarious spin on it, and then recycle it back in to start formal counter-intelligence investigations!

There are a few questions I have for Robert Mueller and I imagine they might be the primary reason as to why Mr. Mueller refused further questioning. I have many more questions, but this is where I would start, because this whole shitstorm was seeded by TDS (Hate for Trump > *) and Russian disinformation that was fed into these systems to a bunch of Trump-hating morons who green lit everything because orange man bad. This huge vulnerability, where the massive NSA system (weapon) can be exploited by a very small group of powerful bureaucrats for political ends, and our susceptibility to foreign intelligence being mainlined in to fuel these pernicious abuses of power, HAVE NOT BEEN FIXED/RECTIFIED/REMEDIED/ETC.

1.) When were you first informed that the Russian Collusion Hoax was just a wild fever-dream hallucination/conspiracy theory?
a. We know that Andy [Ridiculous Legal Theories and Unethical Tactics get my Cases Thrown out on Appeal] Weissman was briefed in early 2017 about the ‘salacious and verified’ Dossier (which was written by Glenn Simpson and published in a 2007 WSJ article, ‘How Lobbyists Help Ex-Soviets Woo Washington’ but was submitted by Chris Steele to obfuscate the source, aka intelligence laundering) many months before the appointment of independent counsel.
2.) Why were the Russian leads buried while Americans and western intel assets portrayed as being compromised or in league with the Kremlin?
a. We know Stefan Halper is a CIA human asset who had been infiltrating the teams of various political campaigns, beginning in 2015.
b. Halper and Richard Dearlove are deeply tied to MI5/MI6, at the highest echelons, and they cooperatively led the Cambridge Intelligence Seminar (CIS), which also employed two active Russian operatives.
c. In his meeting with Deputy Assistant Secretary of State Christine Kavalec, Chris Steele informed her that he had two sources for his dossier information: Vyacheslav Trubnikov and Vladislav Surkov, both of whom are in Putin’s inner circle and specialize in propaganda and media manipulation, and both of whom taught at the CIS with Halper and Dearlove. (This was 10 days before the issuance of the first FISA warrant)
d. Joseph Mifsud, who was working an active clandestine counter-intelligence operation against a major campaign advisor: George Papadopoulos, is a known western intel asset and can be seen fraternizing with everyone from Claire Smith to Boris Johnson.
3.) Why did you spend millions of dollars and three years (altogether) of OUR lives running failed clandestine counter-ops against political targets and then, when those failed, interrogate those targets for tens of hours until an inevitable memory lapse permitted a prosecution of petty process crimes?
a. The threats that were lodged carried felonies, years in prison, and huge fines, while the plea bargains included misdemeanors and little-to-no jail time.
4.) The infamous ‘Trump Tower Meeting’ has been lauded as a smoking gun, yet the entire event was orchestrated by Obama’s ‘fixer’ Alexandra Chalupa and FUSIONGPS, why were none of the circumstances or persons involved investigated? If this was truly a nefarious meeting, as suggested by your Mueller Dossier, wouldn’t it make sense to follow the money which leads right back to the DNC coffers?
5.) The multitudinous, multifaceted, and egregious microcosm of corruption that ultimately led to this investigation are as pervasive as they are reprehensible. What part of the directive that you were tasked with led you to believe that a right and proper determination would be to ignore all of the preexisting evidence implicating a vast swath of individuals, each of whom engaged in a rampant pattern of flagrant corruption, but instead, compile a large documentation of undoubtedly non-crimes in what appears to be an incompetent attempt to justify impeachment?
6.) After it was apparent that your incompetent pile of crap was not going to precipitate impeachment proceedings, why did you decide to go on TV, contradict what you had previously stated several times (ref: OLC Decision), metaphorically dumping kerosene onto the fire that is Trump-Derangement Syndrome (TDS) sufferers?
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Jun 6 2019 02:39pm
https://www.scribd.com/document/412589985/Flynn-Doc-85

Flynn 302

/e this is both the Flynn 302 documents: one copy from 2/15/2017, and a later amended copy from 5/31/2017
I'd need someone else to analyze and figure out what the changes are, and whether theres anything interesting in there. Skimming over it it just seems like what we already knew- they asked Flynn about Kisylak, then asked about the UN vote and Russian tit-for-tat, and he said he didn't know anything about it.

This post was edited by Goomshill on Jun 6 2019 02:54pm
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Jun 6 2019 03:00pm
Quote (Goomshill @ Jun 6 2019 03:39pm)
https://www.scribd.com/document/412589985/Flynn-Doc-85

Flynn 302

/e this is both the Flynn 302 documents: one copy from 2/15/2017, and a later amended copy from 5/31/2017
I'd need someone else to analyze and figure out what the changes are, and whether theres anything interesting in there. Skimming over it it just seems like what we already knew- they asked Flynn about Kisylak, then asked about the UN vote and Russian tit-for-tat, and he said he didn't know anything about it.


Traitor! Lock him up!
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Jun 7 2019 07:01am
Quote (Goomshill @ Jun 6 2019 08:04pm)


We've already known that Kilimnik was regularly in touch with Western diplomats, although Solomon is providing more information.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/at-height-of-russia-tensions-trump-campaign-chairman-manafort-met-with-business-associate-from-ukraine/2017/06/18/6ab8485c-4c5d-11e7-a186-60c031eab644_story.html




I'm not seeing the angle on criticizing Mueller for not including the information in the report. Mueller's job is to outline a person's ties as it relates to Russian interference, and the FBI assesses that Kilimnik had ties to Russian intelligence. There's a lot of characters with murky ties in this Russiagate saga(Kilimnik, Sater, Mifsud, Steele, Deripaska, etc).

But I suppose we'll be seeing these kind of stories for the foreseeable future. Every new revelation is something Mueller is corruptly concealing.
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Jun 7 2019 07:16am
Quote (IceMage @ Jun 7 2019 08:01am)
We've already known that Kilimnik was regularly in touch with Western diplomats, although Solomon is providing more information.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/at-height-of-russia-tensions-trump-campaign-chairman-manafort-met-with-business-associate-from-ukraine/2017/06/18/6ab8485c-4c5d-11e7-a186-60c031eab644_story.html

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D8bPgbrVsAAX9VU.jpg


I'm not seeing the angle on criticizing Mueller for not including the information in the report. Mueller's job is to outline a person's ties as it relates to Russian interference, and the FBI assesses that Kilimnik had ties to Russian intelligence. There's a lot of characters with murky ties in this Russiagate saga(Kilimnik, Sater, Mifsud, Steele, Deripaska, etc).

But I suppose we'll be seeing these kind of stories for the foreseeable future. Every new revelation is something Mueller is corruptly concealing.


The report paints Kilimnik as a Russian agent to accuse Manafort of guilt by association.

People with knowledge of the situation are disputing that characterization, going so far as to say he's working for the US government, and Mueller would have presumably known this from the get-go.

That's an awfully convenient "mistake".
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Jun 7 2019 07:32am
Quote (bogie160 @ Jun 7 2019 08:16am)
The report paints Kilimnik as a Russian agent to accuse Manafort of guilt by association.

People with knowledge of the situation are disputing that characterization, going so far as to say he's working for the US government, and Mueller would have presumably known this from the get-go.

That's an awfully convenient "mistake".


It wasn't a mistake. Mueller's job is to lay out the relevant evidence as it relates to Russian interference, not to provide a complete picture of every person. Kilimnik talking to the State Department doesn't preclude him from having ties to Russian intelligence. And the report also outlines the rest of his behavior(obstructing justice, ties to Deripaska, receiving internal polling data, giving Manafort a Russia-friendly Ukrainian peace plan), which doesn't strike me as "American asset".
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Jun 7 2019 08:55am
Quote (IceMage @ Jun 7 2019 08:32am)
It wasn't a mistake. Mueller's job is to lay out the relevant evidence as it relates to Russian interference, not to provide a complete picture of every person. Kilimnik talking to the State Department doesn't preclude him from having ties to Russian intelligence. And the report also outlines the rest of his behavior(obstructing justice, ties to Deripaska, receiving internal polling data, giving Manafort a Russia-friendly Ukrainian peace plan), which doesn't strike me as "American asset".



Is he going to give Manafort an American friendly peace plan? Given the reality on the ground, what good would that do?

I'm glad we agree that Mueller is a prosecutor first and foremost. His work by definition is biased towards the prosecution. I suppose that makes the find of no collusion more impactful in retrospect.

I don't see how you can agree with that, though, and still wonder that concerned parties are combing through the report and calling out misrepresentations. Mueller's role was not as an unbiased fact finder, so I'm glad we have responsible journalists taking him to task.

This post was edited by bogie160 on Jun 7 2019 08:57am
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