d2jsp
Log InRegister
d2jsp Forums > Off-Topic > General Chat > Political & Religious Debate > Gamergate 2023
Prev11617181920Next
Add Reply New Topic New Poll
Member
Posts: 23,970
Joined: Feb 28 2007
Gold: 35,554.14
Warn: 10%
Feb 13 2023 07:24am
Do no harm...

"Okay, let's just hop up here and I will cut your dick off."
-Dr. Juardo Dikgo
oncology specialist

This post was edited by sirthom on Feb 13 2023 07:25am
Member
Posts: 92,959
Joined: Dec 31 2007
Gold: 2,299.94
Feb 13 2023 07:39am
Using medical skepticism as an argument against a niche part of the trans community wanting immunity to criticism isn't that strong of an argument, imo. just look how that worked for fat fat fatties. they'll legit attack people who say they're medically unhealthy, even if they're doctors.

but that's never been the whole issue, some small % want full immunity, and the silence of those on their side who dont agree gives it credence. if a doctor posted a study that cast doubt on child hormone treatment, and the small batch of trans activists went after them, maybe 1 in 100 "trans allies" liberals would speak up.

this isnt an issue exclusive to liberals, but this topic is about trans JKR issues.
Member
Posts: 9,256
Joined: Dec 28 2007
Gold: 0.00
Feb 13 2023 07:44am
Quote (Jupe @ Feb 13 2023 07:17am)
:lol: do you think gaming journalism should only be about whether or not the game is fun to play?


No, journalism is all about what sells the most copies of itself.
Member
Posts: 34,186
Joined: May 25 2007
Gold: 21.00
Warn: 10%
Feb 13 2023 10:33am
Quote (tn5421 @ Feb 12 2023 12:23pm)
Can't help but notice this question got ignored. I'm seconding this question.


whenever someone does answer its usually the same thing - they want additional rights that other people do not have, such as entering the bathroom/locker room of the opposite sex
Member
Posts: 78,723
Joined: Nov 30 2008
Gold: 493.00
Feb 13 2023 02:32pm
Quote (blahaj @ Feb 12 2023 05:45pm)
calling it transphobic isnt really accurate, i would consider her willingly ignorant to anti trans propaganda, an ally to the gender critical movements as they call themselves

she bolsters their movements and gives them a bit more of a voice, but it really was more localized to...well, not north america, more europe...

if you do even a miniscule amount of digging on the gender critical movement, you will find that it isnt innocent in nature...

its that kind of "trans woman exists therefor my rights as a "true woman(whatever that means)" are being infringed on, must destroy transgender existence!"

but they mask their intent(usually they are mask off though) by claiming that trans erasure is simply "gross hyperbole" and find little shields to get behind logically, making the trans movements walk into circles and sound stupid

never argue with an idiot, they will bring you down to their level, and beat you with experience, is the general idea here

and since im sure alot of people here want to know what i think about it.... some random idiot on twitter, trans or not, if they are saying buying the game supports trans suicide, they are mislead

but even the middle of the pack should realize that when enough people say something about a group of people, it becomes a reality after enough amplification has been gotten on it

we do not demand to be thrown into society and have people accept us taking shits into litter boxes in childrens schools, or whatever crazy stories the media tries to come up with

we simply wish to take our hormones, get our surgeries if we so wish, and find our place in society, and an overwhelming majority of us do not wish to make our trans identity the mask of our entire being, i know i dont.

the past 5 years or so, we have seen alot in anti lgbt rhetoric, the easiest minority to attack mask off in broad daylight for major media outlets are transgender youth, and because of that the "too woke" narrative got created

the situation became a culture war that non trans political movements started to virtue signal their ranks to get in line. so much so that both sides, not just the aggressors, are becoming out of line


Thanks for sharing your thoughts. It's different from what I've come to expect from my time on social media.
Member
Posts: 9,256
Joined: Dec 28 2007
Gold: 0.00
Feb 13 2023 08:09pm
Quote (El1te @ Feb 13 2023 10:33am)
whenever someone does answer its usually the same thing - they want additional rights that other people do not have, such as entering the bathroom/locker room of the opposite sex


Oh, I know. I just wanted to see if they'd try to justify it in some way, or if they would own it.
Member
Posts: 64,763
Joined: Oct 25 2006
Gold: 0.00
Feb 13 2023 10:39pm
Quote (Jupe @ Feb 13 2023 07:14am)
^NetflixAdaptationWidow

Yeah I didn't intend to make bullying/discrimination two categories, they're the same thing. I would say I'm still skeptical about the detransition rate, but that's not to say I think there needs to be any changes because of that skepticism alone; the longer time goes on and the more studies/information available the better. That website was interesting to peruse, but their main 2015 study feels irrelevant today since things are vastly different now (female trans patients have skyrocketed). And for some reason one of their 2022 sources links to the 2015 article? If it holds true and very low amounts of people regret transitioning, that is a good thing though.

As I mentioned in an earlier post though when referencing the trans surgeon, I don't like the attitude: if you question conventional treatments (affirmative care, puberty blockers, hormonal treatment) you're perpetuating trans suicide. The research on the puberty blockers and hormone treatment seem up in the air.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33529227/
https://i.imgur.com/qaEtFAA.png (mostly positive, which is good)

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33251587/

And it seems some countries are beginning to take a completely different approach to the treatment of trans children. I know NZ is focusing on mental health, but what's your opinion Sweden's approach? Do you think they're going to cause a massive spike in trans children suicide rates?
https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/sweden-pulls-way-back-from-gender-affirming-care-for-children/


The evidence is limited but overwhelmingly shows willing detransition is incredibly rare among trans individuals, including youths. This is pretty common sense IMO. If you want to undergo a transition, you've got to feel pretty strongly about it. People aren't just given puberty blockers and then transition after they're adults because they felt like it one day. This is a very long process with a ton of hurdles within the medical establishment and from social friction. It's pretty unlikely somebody who's willing to go through those hurdles would willingly detransition due to the filtering.

Depends what you mean by "up in the air". We know puberty blockers are pretty low risk. It's not a drastic step to put kids on puberty blockers if they are adament about being trans and that's coroborated by their teachers and parents. There's a myth in conservative circles about kids being pushed into being trans by progressive parents who want a special child, but that's just fucking dumb. The reality is that even well meaning parents are hesitant to put their kids on medical treatments and so are doctors.

I think of Sweden is giving trans children proper care we likely won't see a huge spike in suicidality. The biggest thing that causes suicide is lack of social support. We should follow the evidence where it goes, and so far the evidence suggests puberty blockers and other treatments are helpful. The reason the attitude of "if you question conventional treatments you're perpetuating trans suicide" exists is because that position is overwhelmingly taken by overtly malicious actors, and not well meaning centrists who are seeking to educate themselves on the topic. I had a ton of questions about trans people and the efficacy of treatments (like 8 years ago, because this isn't a new debate) and never once got talked to as though I was going to increase trans suicide rates. It's all about how you approach it, and there's VASTLY more malicious actors seeking to actively harm trans kids and trans adults by creating controversy and delaying treatment than there are people honestly seeking education on the subject.
Member
Posts: 56,972
Joined: Nov 7 2009
Gold: 2,195.68
Feb 14 2023 06:41am

:lol: I feel like we must just be looking at different information regarding a lot of this. I've seen critique towards studies justifying the low rate of detransitioners. The same with the medical treatment; studies point out there isn't enough information available to really determine what the consequences of how puberty blockers/hormone/surgery treatment turns out in the long-term or their overall success. These combined factors are the reason why Sweden is bucking the norm of 'affirmation treatment.'
Per one Sweden treatment facility:
Quote
This decision comes amid growing unease in some quarters regarding the speed at which hormonal treatment of children with gender dysphoria has become accepted as the norm in many countries, despite what critics say is a lack of evidence of any benefit, plus known harms, of treatment.


Quote
There's a myth in conservative circles about kids being pushed into being trans by progressive parents who want a special child, but that's just fucking dumb.

:rofl: that gave me a hearty laugh, I actually remember listening to an Ezra Klein podcast where he interviewed a gender studies professor. He mentioned his son dressed up in a woman's dress to look 'pretty' like his mum. I bet that made conservatives seethe

This post was edited by Jupe on Feb 14 2023 06:48am
Go Back To Political & Religious Debate Topic List
Prev11617181920Next
Add Reply New Topic New Poll