d2jsp
Log InRegister
d2jsp Forums > Off-Topic > General Chat > Political & Religious Debate > Did Biden Just Declare Real War Against Russia?
Prev1161718192025Next
Add Reply New Topic New Poll
Member
Posts: 92,978
Joined: Dec 31 2007
Gold: 2,299.94
Mar 29 2022 10:30am
Quote (ferdia @ Mar 29 2022 11:27am)
xD ok this made me giggle. yes i agree with you.


if you're ever bored youtube up an Andrew Jackson documentary. he's one of the figures that is celebrated to this day but is one of the worst presidents and leaders we ever had. how he got onto the 20$ bill is beyond me, he was a disaster that set the stage for the Civil War, and his crimes are somehow forgotten and his military heroism and title as man of the people endures. but overall he was in my opinion a piece of shit that makes even Trump look fairly good.
Member
Posts: 39,696
Joined: Nov 16 2005
Gold: 13.37
Mar 29 2022 10:30am
Quote (Lebanon961 @ 29 Mar 2022 14:54)


Go Ukraine
Member
Posts: 92,978
Joined: Dec 31 2007
Gold: 2,299.94
Mar 29 2022 10:32am
Quote (Goomshill @ Mar 29 2022 11:23am)
To the first point, it was only about a year into his term, iirc, that Trump's administration published the formal Trump doctrine for foreign policy. And it was pretty blunt and explicit about reducing American military interventionalism while stepping up American economic interventionalism. It said economic security is national security. And that's what Trump had been saying since before I was born, I think. I remember he was loudly declaring it against the Japanese in the 80s and 90s, that they were eating our lunch and the answer wasn't rockets and battleships, it was tariffs and subsidies. Trump had no interest in all that geopolitically destabilizing regime change nonsense and is joined by Ford and Carter in being the only presidents not to load us into any new wars during his term, and that's generously giving Carter a pass on Operation Eagle Claw


carter was a GOAT level president, just look at all those houses he made for poor people.
Member
Posts: 3,046
Joined: Oct 1 2021
Gold: 1,979.01
Mar 29 2022 10:39am
Quote (thesnipa @ Mar 29 2022 07:43am)
1. perhaps you can explain to me how the comparison is invalid

2. no, just as a war with Russia hasn't started under Biden


It's invalid because the two countries, and local circumstances, are categorically vastly different. The only similarity is that both leaders are broadly considered to be dictators.

I didn't say a war started "with Russia". I asked you if a war started. The answer to that is, yes.
Member
Posts: 92,978
Joined: Dec 31 2007
Gold: 2,299.94
Mar 29 2022 10:45am
Quote (Nibthebarb @ Mar 29 2022 11:39am)
It's invalid because the two countries, and local circumstances, are categorically vastly different. The only similarity is that both leaders are broadly considered to be dictators.

I didn't say a war started "with Russia". I asked you if a war started. The answer to that is, yes.


That's the only similarity? not that both were responses to nuclear threats? you realize situations dont need to be equivalent to be comparable, right? that's what a comparison is, it draws on similarities between two things to illustrate a point.

as to the War comment i dont know specifically what point you're trying to make.
Member
Posts: 40,248
Joined: Feb 14 2007
Gold: 5,737.99
Mar 29 2022 11:05am
Quote
Biden at the Improv: Ukraine and the Dangers of Foreign Policy by Open Mic

At what point does Joe Biden’s verbal incontinence start to become a mortal threat to Americans?

Until now we’ve mostly had the luxury of observing the president’s many rhetorical infelicities with a mixture of mild puzzlement and gentle concern, as one might watch an aging relative struggle to remember the name of one’s children.

But some words have larger consequences than others—especially when you’re the president of the United States. It’s one thing to misidentify your vice president as the first lady, quite another to call for the ouster of an autocratic and bellicose leader of a nation with nuclear weapons. That is the kind of thing that can trigger wars that could result in the annihilation of much of humanity.

It’s a sign of the rising alarm the presidential blunders must be causing in diplomatic circles that the White House communications shop has stopped attempting to correct the gaffes that come flying like grapeshot from a cannon. Instead they take the Humpty Dumpty approach. Instead of issuing corrections or clarifications of Mr. Biden’s words, they simply invoke Humpty’s philosophy on the president’s behalf: “Whenever I use a word . . . it means just what I choose it to mean—neither more nor less.”

This exercise in through-the-looking-glass semantics was on display last week throughout the president’s trip to Europe, where he sought to rally allies in support of Ukraine and against Russian aggression.

At North Atlantic Treaty Organization headquarters in Brussels on Thursday, Mr. Biden was asked what the U.S. would do if Vladimir Putin used chemical weapons in Ukraine. He said the West would respond “in kind.” You might think, deploying commonly understood definitions, that he meant to convey the somewhat shocking threat that NATO would retaliate against use of a weapon of mass destruction with a like attack. But you’d be wrong. Later, Jake Sullivan, the president’s national security adviser, said that while Russia would pay a heavy price if it used such weapons, the U.S. had “no intention of using chemical weapons, period, under any circumstances.”

The next day in Poland, the president casually remarked to American troops stationed there that some of them had already been in Ukraine and others would be going soon. Soon another administration Humpty was on the line to reporters, insisting that Mr. Biden’s words were in no way inconsistent with the fact that the U.S. had no forces in Ukraine and no plans to send any.

On Saturday we had the most arresting breach between presidential words and improvised official definitions. At the end of an impassioned speech that denounced Vladimir Putin’s aggression and framed the struggle as a battle between democracy and tyranny, Mr. Biden threw down a gauntlet: “For God’s sake, this man cannot remain in power.”

This apparent call for regime change in Moscow, was, we were instantly told, nothing of the sort. “The president’s point was that Putin cannot be allowed to exercise power over his neighbors or the region,” according to an unnamed White House official. “He was not discussing Putin’s power in Russia, or regime change.”

We can’t go on like this. Credibility is essential to the effective and safe conduct of national security. No amount of hasty cleanup will erase the words that come from the lips of a commander in chief. And no, it is not a defense of the president to note—accurately—that his immediate predecessor was as notorious for his verbal indiscipline as Mr. Biden is.

For now, we have an immediate and escalating problem with this presidency. We can certainly hope that Russians understand as well as we do that, at 79, Mr. Biden is prone to saying things he doesn’t mean. But we can’t be sure. What we can be sure of is that Mr. Putin, who has already whipped up his compatriots into a frenzy of paranoia about the “real” intentions of the U.S. in arming Ukraine—to wit, an attempt to weaken and destroy Russia itself—will seize on every piece of evidence he can find to bolster his case.



https://www.wsj.com/amp/articles/biden-speech-gaffe-poland-war-ukraine-russia-putin-regime-change-troops-wmd-chemical-weapons-mental-decline-nuclear-war-11648485191
Member
Posts: 64,763
Joined: Oct 25 2006
Gold: 0.00
Mar 29 2022 11:11am
Quote (IgoSoHard @ Mar 29 2022 12:05pm)


Man, if only we didn't have four years of foreign policy by open mic. Might make it easier to hold an executive to account for a gaffe.

Oh well. That's what happens when you constantly escalate with no regard for the good of the country. The other side stops taking your criticism seriously and it becomes impossible to hold anybody to account.

Personally I'd love it if we could hold Biden to account for his gaffes. We knew that was going to be a problem based on his history. But there's really no mechanism left to do it anymore.

This post was edited by NetflixAdaptationWidow on Mar 29 2022 11:15am
Member
Posts: 3,046
Joined: Oct 1 2021
Gold: 1,979.01
Mar 29 2022 11:14am
Quote (thesnipa @ Mar 29 2022 09:45am)
That's the only similarity? not that both were responses to nuclear threats? you realize situations dont need to be equivalent to be comparable, right? that's what a comparison is, it draws on similarities between two things to illustrate a point.

as to the War comment i dont know specifically what point you're trying to make.


Blah blah blah. Just take the L, your guy sucks, and everyone knows it. Record low approvals even among the Democrat base. Or just keep dying on the Biden hill, doesn't matter to me.
Member
Posts: 92,978
Joined: Dec 31 2007
Gold: 2,299.94
Mar 29 2022 11:15am
Quote (Nibthebarb @ Mar 29 2022 12:14pm)
Blah blah blah. Just take the L, your guy sucks, and everyone knows it. Record low approvals even among the Democrat base. Or just keep dying on the Biden hill, doesn't matter to me.


im not a democrat or biden supporter, but i guess if that's all you have i understand.
Member
Posts: 64,763
Joined: Oct 25 2006
Gold: 0.00
Mar 29 2022 11:16am
Quote (Nibthebarb @ Mar 29 2022 12:14pm)
Ah shit, he made a bunch of good points. Better just tell him he lost so I don't have to address any of them. Yeah, that'll make me look smart. Better also claim not to care. Yeah, I'm super cool.


ftfy
Go Back To Political & Religious Debate Topic List
Prev1161718192025Next
Add Reply New Topic New Poll