What civil liberties was Hillary planning on taking away?

The limited use of military force doesn't really affect you in any way, I don't know why you're so anal about it. Every American president(including Trump) engages in certain conflicts during their presidency... Trump has continued the war on terror, he's increased troop levels in Afghanistan, and he's armed Ukraine. It looks like a North Korea that can successfully launch a nuclear strike on the continental United States is something we have to accept now. Even with all the bluster, I don't think Trump is stupid enough to preemptively strike them.

I'm glad you're holding Trump to a high standard... if we don't get into thermonuclear war, it went better than expected! Lol. I don't think he should be impeached because he acts like a 12 year old girl on twitter, I just criticize it because I have the radical notion that the most powerful man in the world shouldn't act like a 12 year old girl on twitter.

This post was edited by IceMage on Feb 8 2018 08:56am

Oh, the gradual expansion of domestic surveillance, impingement on free expression, institutionalized discrimination based on sex/race/etc, that sort of thing. If the polling showed public favorability, she'd be on top of tweaking the first amendment to allow hate speech laws. All the battlefronts of the war on civil liberties being waged in our political culture right now, she'd be trying her hardest to side with the winner. And accelerate the federal encroachment where she could get away with it.



The country can survive another Iraq or Afghanistan level of quagmire without tear apart, but it does affect me if we get steered into one by a blunderhawk like hillary. Trump has stayed our course without bungling it so far, and I'm sure we'll both be watching carefully for his missteps but they won't be getting us annihilated in our sleep. I don't think Hillary was going to get us vaporized, but I do think she would have sucked us into another vietnam-lite, because that's what her proven track record shows.



And I have a long list of critical notions and policies and issues to care about and would put Trump being a big orange monkey about near the bottom. Once we've cured cancer, averted global warming, put a chicken in every pot and two cars in every garage, and you know, maybe put an end to a culture of pervasive abuse of power by unaccountable secret government organizations who can mask and obfuscate their misdeeds, then maybe I'd find Trump's antics troublesome enough to care. For now, I care more about what he will or won't do on climate change and the pros and cons of his every action, with plenty to mull over in both categories, and I'm not going to read the analysis that deserves in media obsessed with whether Trump overfed some koi fish

i wonder if by 2019 we can finally stop hearing "well HRC would have been _______" in literally every post.

my guess is it wont go away even by 2024.

I think its been a troubling disingenuous trend from the left to want to bury her and forget about her because it shows indefensible positions.
Nothing exists in this world as an absolute, only relative. And Trump is relative to Hillary, republicans relative to democrats, and Nunes and Schiff are ying to each others yang and probably guiltily hatefuck one another in the capitol bathhouses.
Go on ground zero of the neoliberal circlejerk that is /r/politics and say the words 'Hillary Clinton' out loud and you'll get buried under "STOP BRINGING HER UP" replies

Hillary, Obama, Bush, even Romney and Gore all have their significant roles in how we've gotten where we are and influence where we're going. As I've pointed out endlessly, the Russiaburger nonsense originated with Hillary, not just as the weaponized damage control, but sparked by Putin's revenge against her slight, something even she's openly acknowledged. So as long as these threads continue to twist through our public discourse and loom over Trump's presidency, the history behind them can't be just chucked aside as inconvenient.

Hillary's not going to stop poisoning the democrats by 2024, probably not by 2032 at this rate. They had a chance to try to rip up the establishment and start anew, and instead they doubled down. The 2020 candidates will dance around her to try to avoid being tarred with her brush without denouncing her, the third way democrat power structure isn't going anywhere. And who knows, maybe their losses were only temporary and a clinton proxy will get sworn in january 2021. Or maybe Hillary herself, its still possible.

the left tried to resuscitate a dead bird, it was stupid to even try, the damn bird already smelled like shit. So after a failed attempt they buried it in the back yard. Now the right is playing the role of the family dog, digging up the dead bird every time he's let out of the house. Dragging it back up to the front step and plopping it down.

its just funny that the party of "you lost in 2016 get over it" is also the party of "oh yeah? you think HRC would be better?" There's users in this sub who quite literally have 50+ posts that are just "you lost in 2016 get over it" copy pasta. these same users have HRC's balls on their chin, defaulting to her at every turn. The right wants to keep zombie HRC on the podium for 30 years that's fine, just keep the "get over it" rhetoric down. or just continue to look like a pack of baboons. its w/e to me

Hey, at least we’re still on topic, who do you think will win ? Trump vs Clinton

itshappening.gif

They want to keep the neoliberals as their punching bags and the democrats oblige

some investments are high risk short term, low risk long term. Dems are picking stocks, GOP is holding onto 2% treasury bonds. The GOP will reap the counter culture for the next generation, but the GOP's time avoiding moderating their platform wont last forever. and if the dems keep this up i dont see the off ramp for the right, they have to stay as far right as the dems stay left. the next generation will fall to the far left in droves at this pace. but those short run baby boomer gains and angry white boys sure do look good next to volatility. the opportunity cost loss is just going to be staggering if the meta holds, devoid of some culture shifting paradigm i dont conceive as plausible.



Chelsea beats Ivanka.

This post was edited by thesnipa on Feb 8 2018 10:17am

Any actual specifics on that?

Hillary's position on criminal justice reform impressed me. With a Republican congress she might not get any legislation passed on that, but staffing the DOJ with criminal justice reformers would make a difference. I tend to look at throwing a shitton of non-violent black people into prison as a more serious affront to liberty than giving the NSA more tools for collection or passing some equal pay law. I mean if Rand Paul was her opponent I could see your argument, but Trump isn't some civil libertarian... he's the guy who talked about expanding libel laws and enacting a Muslim ban.

I think Hillary understands we don't want another Iraq war on our hands, but she's not afraid to use limited military force to accomplish a worthwhile objective. It's also absurd to think she hasn't learned any lessons from the last couple decades of conflict in the Middle East.

I understand that viewpoint. Policy is more important obviously, but it's bothersome that he acts like such an idiot. I view it as an indictment of our culture... the left-wing was already somewhat there, but now the right-wing doesn't seem to care about decency either.

On policy, I just don't agree with much of what he's done. I'm a deficit hawk, I'm not a protectionist, I think we need to take climate change seriously, I'm pro-CJ reform, I'm pro-diplomacy, etc. Trump has fallen short on all those issues.

They like to pretend I bring her up... but they start it every time.