the wall around Gaza wasnt needed if the Palestinians werent firing rockets and grenades on israeli settlements all the time, trying to stab or club to death israeli police officers, and so on.

criticism of the policies of israel is legitimate in principle. but in the specific case of israel, there is a fine line between legitimate criticism and anti-semitism - this line is crossed when someone demands policies and actions from israel which would predictably lead to their extermination, so that those policy demands are effectively denying the state of israel its right to exist and to defend itself...

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Aug 26 2018 11:38am

thats exactly the point, israel cant afford to be as soft as we are, its stupid to hold them to the same "standards"

Israel are too heavy handed with the protesters at the border, even considering their aggression. If you've got guns and a wall, and they've got molotov cocktails and stones, you shouldn't be opening fire with the intent to kill. Legitimate criticism can be made of Israel here which doesn't constitute anti-semitism.

The 1947 partitioning of India to create Pakistan has been acknowledged and respected, but then globally recognised groups like BDS try to pressure Israel to follow international law while simultaneously denying Israel's UN decreed right to exist. Supporting the BDS movement and other groups that seek to deny Israel's existence or right to exist is anti-semitic without a shadow of a doubt.

This post was edited by dro94 on Aug 26 2018 12:52pm

that is a MASSIVE double standard though. i've consistently criticised palestinian political leadership for their anti israel rhetoric, denying their right to exist is CLEARLY unacceptable. what you guys completely fail to see, however, is the context: while they are SAYING that, israel is DOING it - they have been keeping the palestinian people in a constantly shrinking and deteriorating open air prison for decades now - against international law.

the whole 'b-b-but if israel did not violate the geneva convention, their people would not be allowed to exist' narrative is so flawed and biased that i seriously doubt the intelligence of anyone supporting it. does that justify acts of terror? of course not, but does it explain and contribute to the radicalisation of palestinians? ofc it does. also, when you speak about palestinian terrorism and completely neglect or rationalise the crimes committed by israel (that result in a significantly higher death toll btw), you should really ask yourself if you're even TRYING to look at the whole situation objectively...

of course it contributes to the radicalization of the palestinians. that's the cynical calculus of the Hamas: the more hatred there is between israel and the palestinians, the more miserable their own people are, the more powerful they, the Hamas, become.

israel has tried to make a step towards the palestinians, to loosen their grip on gaza, over and over again, only to be burned every single time. that's why hardliners like Netanjahu are in charge today.

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Aug 26 2018 03:57pm

argument

https://foreignpolicy.com/2018/05/16/netanyahu-needs-conflict-to-survive/

fix'd

also, nice dodge on the rest, nice dodge on israel's part in this dirty game...

This post was edited by fender on Aug 26 2018 04:23pm

I dont deny that israel also plays a part in all of this, and that israeli hardliners are happily adding fuel to the fire. this doesnt, however, change the fundamental threat israel is faced with: a tiny country surrounded by hostile neighbors from a hostile religion/culture, in a hostile corner of the world; with very limited manpower and no strategic depth. israel is constantly one bad decision away from getting annihilated. they dont have all the power when it comes to the treatment of the palestinians - a large-scale outbreak of the palestinians into israel's territory could easily destabilize and weaken them enough to give the surrounding countries the strategic opening for the war of extermination that they have been waiting for so long.

when it comes to "illegal treatment": some things israel does are illegal and objectionable, but not everything which carries this label is. one should keep in mind that many bodies of the UN are infiltrated by pro-palestine partisan groups waging a war of propaganda against israel from within the UN.

when it comes to "dodge": just because I dont have the time and the motivation to answer to each and every point you ever make doesnt mean that I "dodged" them out of a lack of counterarguments.

Better build a wall around Israel then, whom are firing rockets/DU rounds on Gaza all the time, shooting tractor drivers for coming close to an Israeli citizen, with a gun luckily, already aimed.... -> State defended/commited (mass)murders because ppl are afraid.

You should make a difference in violent Palestinians and the million ppl living in Gaza, or this would be racist.. I'm disappointed in Dro here as well, gave him some time to reply to your post. And I take it you're not a Berliner.

/e: Seeing the rest of your posts now, makes it look like you intentionally went over the top here...



I should read that

This post was edited by Knoppie on Aug 27 2018 03:43pm