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Mar 22 2020 07:28pm
Quote (thundercock @ Mar 22 2020 07:36pm)
I do find it interesting that conservatives are so bent out of shape about calling it COVID-19/SARS-CoV-2. Like, why INSIST on calling it the Wuhan virus/Chinese virus? Why is COVID-19 so offensive?


Conservatives believe in magic words. It's the same reason why they were so obsessed with calling it "radical islamic terrorism" under Obama, and why they are so desparate to link this to China. If you call it the right thing, the problem will go away like magic.
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Mar 22 2020 07:39pm
Quote (Goomshill @ 23 Mar 2020 01:13)
I think this is one of the real dangers of having a party solely populated by a marriage of cynical pragmatists and fanatics. The fanatics are willing to burn down the house to get their way, happy to let the imperfect teabag the good to death. The cynical pragmatists will push an old lady in front of a bus if its in their rational self-interest. Ever since Wellstone got splattered across a field, nobody has had my interests in mind. And right now, Democrats are being given an opportunity to obstruct any federal response to the crisis. Even if McConnell was willing to bring in Rand Paul in a hazmat suit and go nuclear in the senate to make that vote pass on party lines, Pelosi can swat it down in the house. If the neoliberals pragmatists and fanatic progressives alike decide that defeating Trump is more important than keeping America functioning, they have the power to shut it all down. And they might be 'right'. A prolonged crisis, higher death toll, starvation and riots and breakdown of society and total economic collapse would most likely result in Trump losing his reelection, no matter how much he blames the Democrats. He'd just look pathetic. They could get Biden to push his own proposed super strong response and list all the many ways he would have averted the crisis if he was president, nevermind that he opposed the lockdowns and travel bans and hasn't spoken a word with Pelosi to get this stimulus passed.


But could the Democrats really get away with a situation where we have an escalating crisis in the public health sector and the labor market, Trump is proposing leftist welfare state policies like UBI or paid sick leave to alleviate it, and the Democrats keep rejecting these proposals on the grounds of... well, what?

Would "... something something... EVIL BIG CORPORATIONS!!!111oneoneeleven" really be enough justification for them to keep obstructing amid an ever-increasing crisis without turning the public against them? Could they really get away with denying Trump the policies which they themselves had been calling for all those years?


I just dont buy your take that the Democrats could benefit from a situation where there's a national crisis and the Republican president is trying to pass popular relief measures. Imho, the more promising approach for them is to point out the plentiful mistakes of Trump's coronavirus response and to point out any liberal policy that the GOP now wants to pass. They can frame it in the sense of "we've been right all along - now that a real crisis forces their hand, the Republicans finally admit it by passing the stuff we've been urging for".


On the other hand, the situation is dangerous for the GOP too. If they insist on unpopular relief measures which bail out the big corporations while leaving employees and the small- and medium-sized businesses out in the rain, then they will get crushed, and deservedly so.
If we think of politics as a game of chess, then the coronavirus has made the position incredibly "sharp".

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Mar 22 2020 07:46pm
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Mar 22 2020 07:57pm
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Mar 22 2020 08:39pm)
But could the Democrats really get away with a situation where we have an escalating crisis in the public health sector and the labor market, Trump is proposing leftist welfare state policies like UBI or paid sick leave to alleviate it, and the Democrats keep rejecting these proposals on the grounds of... well, what?

Would "... something something... EVIL BIG CORPORATIONS!!!111oneoneeleven" really be enough justification for them to keep obstructing amid an ever-increasing crisis without turning the public against them? Could they really get away with denying Trump the policies which they themselves had been calling for all those years?


Read the headlines from left-wing outlets, read the reactions on left-wing social media like /r/politics, tell me what you see.
Looks to me like Nancy Pelosi just took the first major and substantive decision in bogging down the crisis response with obstructionism, and is 'getting away with it'.

Quote
I just dont buy your take that the Democrats could benefit from a situation where there's a national crisis and the Republican president is trying to pass popular relief measures. Imho, the more promising approach for them is to point out the plentiful mistakes of Trump's coronavirus response and to point out any liberal policy that the GOP now wants to pass. They can frame it in the sense of "we've been right all along - now that a real crisis forces their hand, the Republicans finally admit it by passing the stuff we've been urging for".

On the other hand, the situation is dangerous for the GOP too. If they insist on unpopular relief measures which bail out the big corporations while leaving employees and the small- and medium-sized businesses out in the rain, then they will get crushed, and deservedly so.
If we think of politics as a game of chess, then the coronavirus has made the position incredibly "sharp".


Voters don't play chess, they play 52 card pickup. The president is going to have his political fortunes tied to the performance of the country no matter who's 'fault' it is. Republicans engaged in massive obstruction against Obama, they didn't suffer any political costs from it. When Obama programs failed, Obama got dinged. Nobody will care what popular proposals Trump kept talking about, if at the end of the day there's an economic collapse, high death toll, mass unemployment and business failures. The voters don't follow the garden path of unwinding who is at fault, they just blame the guy at the helm. Same reason every president gets the blame for economic failures and credit for economic successes, even if they were out of his control.
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Mar 22 2020 08:01pm
Quote (thundercock @ Mar 22 2020 05:36pm)
I do find it interesting that conservatives are so bent out of shape about calling it COVID-19/SARS-CoV-2. Like, why INSIST on calling it the Wuhan virus/Chinese virus? Why is COVID-19 so offensive?


It plays into anti-China rhetoric. We tend to utilize that strategy when the virus "originates" in populations we hold in less-than-positive regard. Similar to how HIV was first called "Gay-cancer", "Gay-related immune disease".

Yet we didn't call Ebola the "Congo Virus".
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Mar 22 2020 08:03pm


Bernie Sanders held a roundtable on a Coronavirus response plan via livestream, with his three guests Alexandria Ocasio Cortez, Ilhan Omar and Rashida Tlaib

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Mar 22 2020 08:03pm
Quote (Handcuffs @ Mar 22 2020 09:01pm)
Yet we didn't call Ebola the "Congo Virus".


We called it Ebola, didn't we? I mean, you just called it Ebola.
Wait until you learn about Lyme Disease....

This post was edited by Goomshill on Mar 22 2020 08:04pm
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Mar 22 2020 08:06pm
Quote (Goomshill @ Mar 22 2020 07:03pm)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-30JR5Cojc

Bernie Sanders held a roundtable on a Coronavirus response plan via livestream, with his three guests Alexandria Ocasio Cortez, Ilhan Omar and Rashida Tlaib


Don't give them ANY views you fucking asshole.
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Mar 22 2020 08:09pm
Quote (thundercock @ Mar 22 2020 09:06pm)
Don't give them ANY views you fucking asshole.


how often do I get an opportunity to masturbate to all four of them at the same time?
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Mar 22 2020 08:20pm
Quote (Thor123422 @ Mar 22 2020 09:28pm)
Conservatives believe in magic words. It's the same reason why they were so obsessed with calling it "radical islamic terrorism" under Obama, and why they are so desparate to link this to China. If you call it the right thing, the problem will go away like magic.


You complain no matter what happens bro.
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Mar 22 2020 08:22pm
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