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Nov 24 2019 04:07pm
"I'm thinking about resigning"

"I never said I was going to resign"

"Hand in your resignation"

Usually takes a week or more of denials before it happens. This was pretty quick.

Richard V. Spencer, turn in your torch, you have been voted off the island.
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Nov 24 2019 04:15pm
Quote (Arsenic_Touch @ Nov 24 2019 05:07pm)
"I'm thinking about resigning"

"I never said I was going to resign"

"Hand in your resignation"

Usually takes a week or more of denials before it happens. This was pretty quick.

Richard V. Spencer, turn in your torch, you have been voted off the island.



Disciplinary action will proceed against Gallagher, but the Navy Secretary can't let something like that slip. Got to go.
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Nov 24 2019 04:41pm
Quote (Arsenic_Touch @ Nov 24 2019 04:07pm)
"I'm thinking about resigning"
"I never said I was going to resign"
"Hand in your resignation"
Usually takes a week or more of denials before it happens. This was pretty quick.
Richard V. Spencer, turn in your torch, you have been voted off the island.


heh that was fast indeed
for anyone who missed it:
https://www.stripes.com/news/navy/dod-chief-asks-for-navy-secretary-s-resignation-over-private-proposal-in-navy-seal-s-case-1.608539

in rapid fire;
  • Trump pardons Gallagher
  • Navy secretary Spencer does an indirect-but-clearly-intentioned rebuke of Trump by saying he'll initiate a review into Gallagher anyway
  • Trump tweets he won't allow the review, but then doesn't issue a formal command saying that
  • Spencer says he'll go ahead anyway if Trump doesn't make it a formal order
  • Media reports that Spencer is threatening to resign if Trump makes it an order
  • Spencer denies that at a press conference and says he never threatened to resign
  • Pentagon chief Esper demands Spencer resign after finding out he made a secret offer to Trump to allow Gallagher to resign without a review if Trump doesn't intervene


I really don't see any way that Gallagher continues to be a seal after everything that went down, so honestly the "sweep it under the rug and let him retire" would have been a fine cynical outcome... except for the part where Spencer tugged on the chain of command and teased around with insubordination. Once he did that, there was no way this be resolved so simply, was there? He could have just said "Its my commander-in-chief's order" and let it be, what difference does it make to him if one SEAL keeps his pin? But nope, the dumb bastard tried to play politics and found out that there's no such thing as a secret in washington
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Nov 24 2019 05:23pm
Quote (Arsenic_Touch @ Nov 24 2019 05:07pm)
"I'm thinking about resigning"

"I never said I was going to resign"

"Hand in your resignation"

Usually takes a week or more of denials before it happens. This was pretty quick.

Richard V. Spencer, turn in your torch, you have been voted off the island.


And he handed in a pretty critical resignation letter.

I know I say this a lot, but the frequency of Trump shooting himself in the foot is just amazing to watch. He doesn't pick up any more voters by pardoning these war criminals... there's no grand strategy to it.... but he does it because Fox News told him to. And now he's needlessly lost his Navy Secretary. Add that to the list of acting positions.
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Nov 24 2019 05:48pm
Quote (IceMage @ Nov 24 2019 06:23pm)
And he handed in a pretty critical resignation letter.

I know I say this a lot, but the frequency of Trump shooting himself in the foot is just amazing to watch. He doesn't pick up any more voters by pardoning these war criminals... there's no grand strategy to it.... but he does it because Fox News told him to. And now he's needlessly lost his Navy Secretary. Add that to the list of acting positions.


The resignation letter doesn't match up with the story, which is interesting.
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Nov 24 2019 05:53pm
Quote (Goomshill @ Nov 24 2019 05:41pm)
heh that was fast indeed
for anyone who missed it:
https://www.stripes.com/news/navy/dod-chief-asks-for-navy-secretary-s-resignation-over-private-proposal-in-navy-seal-s-case-1.608539

in rapid fire;
  • Trump pardons Gallagher
  • Navy secretary Spencer does an indirect-but-clearly-intentioned rebuke of Trump by saying he'll initiate a review into Gallagher anyway
  • Trump tweets he won't allow the review, but then doesn't issue a formal command saying that
  • Spencer says he'll go ahead anyway if Trump doesn't make it a formal order
  • Media reports that Spencer is threatening to resign if Trump makes it an order
  • Spencer denies that at a press conference and says he never threatened to resign
  • Pentagon chief Esper demands Spencer resign after finding out he made a secret offer to Trump to allow Gallagher to resign without a review if Trump doesn't intervene


I really don't see any way that Gallagher continues to be a seal after everything that went down, so honestly the "sweep it under the rug and let him retire" would have been a fine cynical outcome... except for the part where Spencer tugged on the chain of command and teased around with insubordination. Once he did that, there was no way this be resolved so simply, was there? He could have just said "Its my commander-in-chief's order" and let it be, what difference does it make to him if one SEAL keeps his pin? But nope, the dumb bastard tried to play politics and found out that there's no such thing as a secret in washington


Lol

This punches a footsize hole in icemage’s facade
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Nov 24 2019 06:25pm
Also pretty sure that offer translates to both going behind his bosses back and rigging the review process. How can he 'guarantee' the result?
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Nov 25 2019 03:09am
https://www.theepochtimes.com/trump-approval-among-blacks-above-34-percent-emerson-polls-shows_3155737.html

Emerson Poll gives Trump 35% approval among black voters (53 out of 153 sampled), Rasmussen gives 34% approve among black voters, NPR/PBS Marist gives 33% among 'non-white'
Economist/Yougov at 16% for black voters, Morning Consult/Politico at 18%, Gallup at 21% for 'non-white'

there's still some major poll divergence but multiple polls are all indicating Trump's black support is raising significantly, which is a pretty good predictor for 2020
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Nov 25 2019 07:35am
WASHINGTON -- Defence Secretary Mark Esper has fired the Navy's top official, ending a stunning clash between President Donald Trump and top military leadership over the fate of a SEAL accused of war crimes in Iraq.

Esper said Sunday that he had lost confidence in Navy Secretary Richard Spencer and alleged that Spencer proposed a deal with the White House behind his back to resolve the SEAL's case. Trump has championed the matter of Navy Chief Petty Officer Edward Gallagher, who was acquitted of murder in the stabbing death of an Islamic State militant captive but convicted of posing with the corpse while in Iraq in 2017.
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Nov 25 2019 08:30am
I've been thinking lately... people have been speculating that Trump could refuse to leave office if he loses in 2020. I've thought this concern is loony.

But regarding this Ukraine thing... basically the entire Republican party is living in a post-fact fantasy land. They're pretending it wasn't bad at all.

So if the election in 2020 is very close, say it comes down to one state, and the Democratic candidate is deemed the winner. I think it's actually possible Trump refuses to accept the results, therefore Fox News and his voters refuse to accept the results, therefore the vast majority of Republicans refuse to accept the results. We could get in a situation where the president and the Republican party are calling for an unnecessary recount, or perhaps even another election.

This cult of personality is so strong that I think it's possible. Not likely in any way, but possible.
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