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Dec 12 2024 03:19am
Quote (gnarjay @ Dec 11 2024 10:23pm)


this is quite unusual, https://www.newarab.com/news/morocco-try-israeli-soldier-over-war-crimes-gaza would like to see if this story gets picked up by US or western media, I only see it in middle east / african media at the moment.

in the meantime ~ https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/pressure-israeli-university-after-lecturer-arrested-violent-attack-palestinian

Pressure on Israel's Hebrew University after lecturer arrested for attack on Palestinian - Michael Wolfowicz is suspected of the kidnap and brutal beating of a Palestinian alongside Israeli police officers and soldiers

Pressure on the Hebrew University of Jerusalem is growing after one of its lecturers, criminologist Michael Wolfowicz, was arrested on suspicion of kidnapping and violently assaulting a Palestinian alongside eight Israeli police officers and soldiers. Leading the outcry are Palestinian students at universities across Israel, who wrote an open letter condemning the Hebrew University's lack of action. Wolfowicz, a senior lecturer at the faculty of law’s criminology institute, was arrested on Tuesday by the Department of Internal Police Investigations (DIPI), which handles all criminal offences committed by police officers. The lecturer, who denies being at the scene of the incident, which took place in August, is suspected of causing aggravated injury, while other suspects are accused of kidnapping the Palestinian, Laith Awaine, who lives near Bethlehem. In August, Wolfowicz gave a presentation to Israel’s parliament, the Knesset, in which he downplayed settler violence and said that United Nations data on it was based on “false reports”.

The criminologist was a postdoctoral fellow at University College London and told the Knesset that his work had been funded by the European Union and the US Department for Homeland Security. He has written about human rights in Israel and conducted a survey of Israeli prisons. The Palestinian students' letter demanded Wolfowicz's suspension until proven innocent, saying that “someone who assaults a person just for being Arab and Palestinian cannot teach students in general, let alone teach human rights courses to Arab students, especially while being accused of committing a terrorist act against his own people”. “Only in Israeli society can you see an academic commit a terrorist act against a person simply because they are Arab and Palestinian, and the academic instutition where they teach remain silent,” they said. According to details released by DIPI, Awaine was attacked in the Wadi Auja area of the occupied West Bank, north of the Kochav Hashahar settlement, while he was sitting with friends.

Witnesses said the Palestinian was beaten with tree branches and a rifle, thrown into a stream and then forced into a car. He was driven tens of kilometres away and then dumped on the road. Awaine told Haaretz that he still suffers from back pain after the attack. “I feel that I live in a lawful country,” he said in response to the arrests, adding that while he had often visited the valley with friends, he had not been back since the assault. The attackers claimed Awaine was affiliated with Hamas, according to an unnamed Israeli official who spoke to Channel 12, but no evidence has been found to support that. Two witnesses identified the suspects as masked policemen and soldiers, noting that some of them had turned up at the scene in a vehicle with “Border Guard” written on it, Haaretz reported. The witnesses said that the attackers shouted “You are Hamas” at the group of friends, before handcuffing one of them, beating him, throwing him in the stream and abandoning him on the road. According to Haaretz, he lost consciousness and was taken to the West Bank's Turkish hospital. The Israeli newspaper reported the incident in August but at the time the Israeli military and police told reporter Hagar Shezaf that no soldiers or policemen were involved. One of the other reported suspects is Saar Ofir, an Israeli settler previously arrested in July on suspicion of summarily executing a Hamas fighter captured by Israeli forces in Gaza.

An Israeli legal scholar, who did not want to be identified because academics in Israel are targeted professionally for voicing sympathy or support for Palestinians, condemned Wolfowitz and told Middle East Eye his case was indicative of the violent, entwined nature of Israeli society. “This case strongly exemplifies how supposedly discrete institutions within Israeli society - the academy, the military, the police - and supposedly extra-legal settler-vigilante violence are not only aligned but effectively operate in tandem as part of a single regime,” the academic said. 'I feel afraid when I am in the presence of a lecturer of this type' - Abdul Hamid Abu Ghosh, Hebrew University student. “Having longstanding relations with the Israeli army and the Israeli police, holding a coveted position as a faculty member in the criminology institute at the Hebrew University, and now being suspected of horrid and formally ‘illegal’ violence against a Palestinian man, Wolfowicz personifies all three institutions in one.” In his August address to the Knesset, Wolfowicz argued that violence committed by Israeli settlers was massively exaggerated because it was miscategorised. “In my profession I investigate terrorism, violence of Jewish residents of Judea and Samaria, and the imposing of sanctions by other countries,” he said, using the Israeli names for the West Bank. “You can see the United Nations statistics and the Palestinian Authority statistics, which are used as a source of information for the United Nations. The UN figures on 'settler violence' are based on false reports.” Wolfowicz said Israel’s response to “ideologically motivated crime” was “better than many countries', including the UK, which has applied sanctions on settlers for settler violence”.

After news of the lecturer’s alleged involvement in the brutal attack was reported, the dean of the Hebrew University’s Faculty of Law and Criminology messaged the faculty WhatsApp group. “Good evening,” the message read. “In the last few hours, information regarding a faculty member has been circulating in the media. The matter is under investigation, and I would like to cooperate in reducing the intensity until we have reliable information. Thank you.” This response stands in stark contrast to the approach taken by the university in the case of prominent Palestinian academic Nadera Shalhoub-Kevorkian, who was suspended in March 2024 after she said that it was time to “abolish Zionism”. Shalhoub-Kevorkian, who like Wolfowicz was part of the faculty of law’s criminology institute, was then arrested in April by Israeli authorities for “incitement”. Abdul Hamid Abu Ghosh, a student at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem and a member of the Jafta Movement - Democratic Student Gathering, told MEE that as a Palestinian student his experience was one of "alienation and fear". "You study at an institution that has all the military officers and the people who make the laws and look at the texts that legitimise the occupation, apartheid and daily practices against your people," he said. "I feel afraid when I am in the presence of a lecturer of this type."

TLDR here is: The problems in Israeli society are deeply embedded, with Politics, Army, Police and Education all compromised. As such there is no hope for a change in their cultural alignment (of hate and violence) for decades to come. Even if some magical force were to appear and say "Do no Harm" and replace Israeli leaders, it would not solve the underlying problems, which history has shown, would take decades to rectify as they are so embedded into society. This is then compounded by the problem of Hamas and all those Palestinians with a grudge against the atrocities being committed against them. The situation is simply hopeless for the time being. ... and all the while Israel expands its borders which generates the same decades long grievances.

This post was edited by ferdia on Dec 12 2024 03:42am
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Dec 12 2024 05:50am
Quote (ferdia @ Dec 12 2024 11:19am)

TLDR here is: The problems in Israeli society are deeply embedded, with Politics, Army, Police and Education all compromised. As such there is no hope for a change in their cultural alignment (of hate and violence) for decades to come. Even if some magical force were to appear and say "Do no Harm" and replace Israeli leaders, it would not solve the underlying problems, which history has shown, would take decades to rectify as they are so embedded into society. This is then compounded by the problem of Hamas and all those Palestinians with a grudge against the atrocities being committed against them. The situation is simply hopeless for the time being. ... and all the while Israel expands its borders which generates the same decades long grievances.


Your confirmation bias is really showing.
If you knew better, the Hebrew university has a long long history of pro-Palestinian agenda.
But don’t let that interrupt you.

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Dec 12 2024 07:17am
Quote (WhiteSouned @ Dec 12 2024 11:50am)
Your confirmation bias is really showing.
If you knew better, the Hebrew university has a long long history of pro-Palestinian agenda.
But don’t let that interrupt you.


I was fascinated to read several studies, in particular (but not exclusively) "The Failure of Education Policy in Israel: Politics vs. Bureaucracy" - https://repository.upenn.edu/server/api/core/bitstreams/f583e3ae-d4ba-40c2-ba38-503ddad965b6/content





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Dec 15 2024 12:25pm
Israel recently closed its embassy in Ireland due to Dublin's strong and consistent criticism of Israel’s actions in Gaza and its treatment of Palestinians. Ireland has labeled Israeli policies as akin to apartheid and supported international efforts, such as South Africa's ICJ case, to hold Israel accountable under international law.

It would be significant if Israel also chose to close its embassy in Spain for similar reasons, as Spain has also voiced strong support for Palestinian rights. The hope is that more European countries will take a principled stand in supporting peace, advocating for a two-state solution, and calling for an end to apartheid-like policies, paving the way for justice and equality in the region.
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Dec 15 2024 12:32pm
Quote (ferdia @ 15 Dec 2024 20:25)
Israel recently closed its embassy in Ireland due to Dublin's strong and consistent criticism of Israel’s actions in Gaza and its treatment of Palestinians. Ireland has labeled Israeli policies as akin to apartheid and supported international efforts, such as South Africa's ICJ case, to hold Israel accountable under international law.

It would be significant if Israel also chose to close its embassy in Spain for similar reasons, as Spain has also voiced strong support for Palestinian rights. The hope is that more European countries will take a principled stand in supporting peace, advocating for a two-state solution, and calling for an end to apartheid-like policies, paving the way for justice and equality in the region.


2 states solution died on October 7th
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Dec 15 2024 12:39pm
Quote (ferdia @ Dec 15 2024 10:25am)
Israel recently closed its embassy in Ireland due to Dublin's strong and consistent criticism of Israel’s actions in Gaza and its treatment of Palestinians. Ireland has labeled Israeli policies as akin to apartheid and supported international efforts, such as South Africa's ICJ case, to hold Israel accountable under international law.

It would be significant if Israel also chose to close its embassy in Spain for similar reasons, as Spain has also voiced strong support for Palestinian rights. The hope is that more European countries will take a principled stand in supporting peace, advocating for a two-state solution, and calling for an end to apartheid-like policies, paving the way for justice and equality in the region.


united kingdom … the uk always said israel has the right to defend itself, but they also said stuff about palestinians. like, uk said settlement expansion in west bank aint legal. in 2021, uk was like, "israel stop what you’re doing in gaza," and wanted an investigation about war crimes. the uk government dont do much, but lots of british people and the labour party care about palestinian rights.

france … france been friends with israel for a long time, but they’ve been pushing for a two-state thing too. france dont like settlement expansion and told israel not to take more land. in 2020, macron said dont do that and we need peace talks with two states.

belgium … belgium been mad about the settlements, and in 2020, they said palestine’s a state. big change, right? belgium also agrees with other countries saying israel should be investigated for gaza stuff.

sweden … sweden always been about palestinian rights and said palestine is a state back in 2014. sweden dont like settlements and says we need to do something about gaza and the west bank. they support un complaints about israel.

norway … norway helped with peace talks before, like oslo accords. they try to be balanced, but they also hate settlements and what’s going on in gaza. norway wants two states and they help with aid to palestine.

denmark … denmark talks about israel hurting palestinians a lot, especially in gaza. they said ceasefires need to happen and they dont like israel hurting civilians. danish people care a lot about palestinians, and denmark says eu should do more about it.

portugal … portugal been talking about israel’s policies too, saying settlements are illegal. in 2021, portugal’s foreign minister said two-state solution is the way, and israel’s settlements are wrong. portugal also helps with charity stuff in palestine.

switzerland … switzerland dont pick sides, but they still criticize israel. they support un and give help to palestine and try to make peace happen.

italy … italy’s always been for israel, but lately, they’ve been talking about how bad israel’s policies are. in 2020, italian parliament said no more arms sales to israel if they take more land from west bank. government still supports israel, but a lot of people in italy want them to do more for palestinians.

This post was edited by DrFetus on Dec 15 2024 12:41pm
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Dec 15 2024 02:43pm
Quote (ferdia @ Dec 15 2024 01:25pm)
Israel recently closed its embassy in Ireland due to Dublin's strong and consistent criticism of Israel’s actions in Gaza and its treatment of Palestinians. Ireland has labeled Israeli policies as akin to apartheid and supported international efforts, such as South Africa's ICJ case, to hold Israel accountable under international law.

It would be significant if Israel also chose to close its embassy in Spain for similar reasons, as Spain has also voiced strong support for Palestinian rights. The hope is that more European countries will take a principled stand in supporting peace, advocating for a two-state solution, and calling for an end to apartheid-like policies, paving the way for justice and equality in the region.


It’s been eighty years of Israel trying to support a two-state solution and Palestine supporting terrorism against Israel in response. At some point it had to be called. If not now, when?
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Dec 15 2024 03:53pm
Quote (Shadowoffury @ Dec 15 2024 12:43pm)
It’s been eighty years of Israel trying to support a two-state solution and Palestine supporting terrorism against Israel in response. At some point it had to be called. If not now, when?


80 years of oppression, expansion, colonizing and terrorizing native people. it took them starting and filming a genocide on social media for the world to wake up to isra-hell's barbarism and there are STILL pathetic little hypocrites like you defending it.

you said yourself; violence is sometimes the only answer. what else can Palestinians do but fight back against such abuses? terorrism and subjugation are the only languages Israelis understand

This post was edited by gnarjay on Dec 15 2024 03:54pm
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Dec 15 2024 04:16pm
Quote (gnarjay @ Dec 15 2024 04:53pm)
80 years of oppression, expansion, colonizing and terrorizing native people. it took them starting and filming a genocide on social media for the world to wake up to isra-hell's barbarism and there are STILL pathetic little hypocrites like you defending it.

you said yourself; violence is sometimes the only answer. what else can Palestinians do but fight back against such abuses? terorrism and subjugation are the only languages Israelis understand


They’re the only languages Palestine has ever spoken to Israel.

Israel agreed to the UN partition plan, Palestine not only refused, but also refused to sit in the same room as any jews during negotiations, forcing UN officials to run back and forth between two rooms like they were dealing with children… I don’t know where you people get this idea that Palestine has ever given peace any consideration. It’s not true.

This post was edited by Shadowoffury on Dec 15 2024 04:25pm
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