Quote (cambovenzi @ 26 Jun 2017 18:14)

I understand it too. I understand the justification for many terrible laws and acts throughout history.
Doesn't make it any better.

Quote (cambovenzi @ 26 Jun 2017 19:04)

taking nazi ideology seriously by becoming a repressive government that arrests and raids people for free speech they dont like. no irony there.

Quote (cambovenzi @ 26 Jun 2017 20:04)

taking nazi ideology seriously by becoming a repressive government that arrests and raids people for free speech they dont like. no irony there.

Quote (dro94 @ 26 Jun 2017 20:08)

It's not a repressive government though. I don't even agree with it, I just understand it considering their history.

Quote (ampoo @ 26 Jun 2017 19:28)

more or less this :lol:



you really cant make this shit up, the political left, that is lecturing us about the nazi past all the time, has adopted nazi methods to fight opinions they dont agree with
it is not really state based though and works under the cover of "activism"

the upcoming g20 summit is a good example as well, we are close to the state of the weimar republic with ultra leftist thugs terrorising an entire city and justice/politics dont really give a fuck

Quote (fender @ 26 Jun 2017 20:41)

how are they "terrorising" the city? are pegida demonstrations also "terror" or just people you happen to disagree with?
also, please specify the "nazi methods" used to "fight opinions"...

Quote (Scaly @ 26 Jun 2017 20:20)

Bet you would be singing a different tune if they were Muslims talking about how westerners deserve to die rather than skinheads talking about how Jews, blacks, gays and the mentally ill should be exterminated.

After every terror attack it's 'why didn't they arrest them before it happened?'. Because of free speech laws. You can't have it both ways. Either you can arrest someone for expressing a dangerous ideology or you have to wait until they actually take action on it.

Quote

The press is regulated by the law of Germany as well as all 16 States of Germany.[104] The most important and sometimes controversial regulations limiting speech and the press can be found in the Criminal code:
Insult is punishable under Section 185. Satire and similar forms of art enjoy more freedom but have to respect human dignity (Article 1 of the Basic law).
Malicious Gossip and Defamation (Section 186 and 187). Utterances about facts (opposed to personal judgement) are allowed if they are true and can be proven. Yet journalists are free to investigate without evidence because they are justified by Safeguarding Legitimate Interests (Section 193).
Hate speech may be punishable if against segments of the population and in a manner that is capable of disturbing the public peace (Section 130 [Agitation of the People]), including racist agitation and antisemitism.
Holocaust denial is punishable according to Section 130 subsection 3.
Membership in or support of banned political parties (Section 86). Currently banned parties include the SRP and the KPD, but historically all non-Nazi parties have been banned (1933–1945).
Dissemination of Means of Propaganda of Unconstitutional Organizations (Section 86).
Use of Symbols of Unconstitutional Organizations (Section 86a). Items such as the Swastika or clothing of the FDJ is banned.
Disparagement of
the Federal President (Section 90).
the State and its Symbols (Section 90a).
Insult to Organs and Representatives of Foreign States (Section 103).
Rewarding and Approving Crimes (Section 140).
Casting False Suspicion (Section 164).
Insulting of Faiths, Religious Societies and Organizations Dedicated to a Philosophy of Life if they could disturb public peace (Section 166).
Dissemination of Pornographic Writings (Section 184).
Outdoor assemblies must be registered beforehand.[105] Assemblies at memorial sites are banned.[106] Individuals and groups may be banned from assembling, especially those whose fundamental rights have been revoked and banned political parties.[106] The Love Parade decision (1 BvQ 28/01 and 1 BvQ 30/01 of 12 July 2001) determined that for an assembly to be protected it must comply with the concept of a constituent assembly, or the so-called narrow concept of assembly whereby the participants in the assembly must pursue a common purpose that is in the common interest.[107]

Quote

There were 218,414 cases of insults filed with prosecutors in Germany in 2015, down slightly from 225,098 in 2014, but far above numbers of around 150,000 recorded a decade ago. Americans and other foreigners living in Germany sometimes run afoul of the law, unaware of it, and end up being called into police or prosecutor’s offices to explain their side of the story, before their cases are usually dismissed.

Hardly anyone ends up in jail for insulting their neighbor in the midst of a heated dispute, or for flashing the middle finger — the Stinkefinger, or “stinky finger,” as Germans call it — at another motorist in heavy traffic. But cases do wind up in court and fines are sometimes handed down

...

In a precedent-setting 1995 ruling, a Schwaebisch Hall court awarded a man 460 euros over racist comments against his wife, who is black. In 1997, a boss who called a pregnant employee “Germany’s laziest worker” in an in-house magazine was fined 2,500 euros. In 1998, a court in Heilbronn awarded a police officer 350 euros after another person called him a “wanker.”

The law extends to insults made online as well. “If someone makes comments on the Internet that violate the law, German authorities have the right to obtain data from the providers about the person who made the comments in order to go after the perpetrator,” said Gulden.

A Berlin court awarded one person 8,190 euros in 2011 for insults published against him in social media; in a 2012 case, a trainee who made disparaging remarks about her boss on Facebook had to pay 2,500 euros in damages. A student accepted a 5,000 euro out-of-court settlement in 2013 for racist remarks made in a rap song about him posted on YouTube.

Quote (ampoo @ 26 Jun 2017 20:04)

pegida demonstrations have been peaceful as far as i know, i have never seen the "black bloc" marching there attacking the police
have you?

since i can deal with diversity of opinion its certainly not terror to to voice it in public
would be fine, if the political left could settle with that

well, i dont know how many outrages have made the news in the southern parts of germany

police and city real estates have been attacked several times, cars and other vehicles destroyed with fire
hamburg has police forces from other states here since MARCH, because they need 24/7 surveillance
a high ranking police officer had his car set on fire in his garage and the house almost caught fire as well with him and his family sleeping inside (not g20 related though, he dared to have african drug dealers arrested)
leftists are stalking police officers and are threatening them (several reported that their cars had been tampered with, but the issue was not made public so far), two days ago my dad and his colleagues received a warning to watch out for people shadowing them ffs
two left wingers with a criminal record were arrested and they had a van with riot gear, documented private police car plates and addresses (and the judge let them go!)

the city is struck with awe, cant wait until this madness is over

and thats just for starters, our government is so desperate to delete mean comments against islam while the ultra left "linksunten indymedia" can spread their hatred unchecked

and nazi methods to fight opinions, let me ask you ask you something here
do you live under a rock?

looks like you never heard of antifa house visits for members of a certain party they hate, permanent attacks on their election campaign and offices, violent outrages against legal demonstrations that are not pro migration etc
http://www1.wdr.de/nachrichten/ruhrgebiet/sachbeschaedigung-essen-karnap-haus-afd-politiker-guido-reil-100~_v-ARDAustauschformat.jpg

Quote (cambovenzi @ 26 Jun 2017 20:14)

instead of recognizing reality he tries to turn it into some sort of nationalistic pissing contest.
'b-b-ut-but Germany incarcerates less people! hah!'

guess what? i'm not happy with the US government either.

however, free speech is much more freely exercised and protected here. anyone with a clue recognizes this.

This is the 2nd year in a row where widespread raids have targeted people for speech online and made international headlines.
The laws prohibiting various forms of speech, particularly regarding nazism/the holocaust and hate speech are well known.
We are both aware of the recent steps being taken to try to largely expand hate speech criminalization.
I would ask why you are trying to skirt around the issue, but i already know.

Some quick examples from wiki



http://www.latimes.com/world/europe/la-fg-germany-insult-law-snap-story.html

Quote (ampoo @ Jun 26 2017 07:28pm)

more or less this :lol:



you really cant make this shit up, the political left, that is lecturing us about the nazi past all the time, has adopted nazi methods to fight opinions they dont agree with
it is not really state based though and works under the cover of "activism"

the upcoming g20 summit is a good example as well, we are close to the state of the weimar republic with ultra leftist thugs terrorising an entire city and justice/politics dont really give a fuck

Quote (Scaly @ Jun 26 2017 02:20pm)

Bet you would be singing a different tune if they were Muslims talking about how westerners deserve to die rather than skinheads talking about how Jews, blacks, gays and the mentally ill should be exterminated.

After every terror attack it's 'why didn't they arrest them before it happened?'. Because of free speech laws. You can't have it both ways. Either you can arrest someone for expressing a dangerous ideology or you have to wait until they actually take action on it.