Easy to change to the winning team after they've already won.

If you were worth spending 10 fg and time on I'd go look up all your anti-Trump posts from 2017. Probably enough of them to make an entire book out of.

Luckily, I don't have to do that since you're irrelevant. You trying to discuss politics with me is like a 3rd grader trying to have a conversation about physics with Einsten.

My time is actually valuable so it wouldn't be wise to lurk PARD all day. I just come here to reminisce about the great times from last year. Knowing that I alone convinced hundreds, if not thousands of people to vote Trump gives me tremendous joy.

Can't wait to watch him crush the 2020 elections then later tell my kids and grandkids (who will all be raised to vote conservative, btw) about how liberals paraded around in pussy hats and gave Trump his second term basically for free.

When that is how you perceive a conversation, sometimes it is because you are the 3rd grader.

The fact that you consider yourself to be the "Einsten" of PaRD speaks volumes anyway.

ISO: Trump supporters who can argue for their positions without bringing up Hillary, Obama, or the election.

They're everywhere.... you just gotta open your eyes!

i'm not a trump fan, i wasn't an HRC fan, i wasn't an Obama fan. there is no team swapping. maybe instead of flapping your gums just read my posts...

This is one thing I'm glad they came to agreement on. http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2018/06/12/trump-kim-agree-to-recovering-and-returning-us-military-remains-from-korean-war.html

Geopolitically speaking, it isn't as important as denuclearization, but it's an important milestone, regardless.

Ok, seriously, lets all stop the partisan shilling for a moment:

• First, that this meeting was even happening IS a success for trump. Whether it was due to his brilliant strategy or due to lucky timing on his part, he achieved a historic meeting that no president before him got to happen.
  
• Second, we dont really know how much influence trump's fire and fury rhetoric really had. NK has been pursuing a stringent strategy for decades: "Get nukes at any cost, because nukes are a brutal equalizer. And they ensure that no attempts of regime change from either the American or the Chinese side is realistic anymore. Once we have nukes, we can start playing it nice and enter negotiations from a position of power." Maybe Trump was just lucky that this point in the long-term North Korean plan coincided with his presidency. Or maybe his tough talk about bloody nose strike and such has really gotten Kim and his generals scared and prompted them to stop their nuclearization early.
  
• Third, the expectations for todays summit were completely exaggerated. There is a myriad of issues to be discussed, that Trump/Kim wouldnt solve or even discuss all of them on day one had to be expected. In this sense, the fact that today's meeting didnt blow up and instead yielded an agreement to future, more concerted talks, is a success in its own right.
  
• Fourth, Trump actually did the right thing by being nice and assuring towards Kim today. The stage of the negotiations we're in now is all about building up trust, since both sides want huge concessions out of each other. With his fiery rhetoric and his whimsical withdrawal from the Iran deal and the G7 summit declaration, the North Koreans have every reason to distrust Trump's promises during the negotiations to come. He has a lot of work to do to convince them to trust him.
  
• Fifth, the North Koreans did indeed "win" today's first round. The commitment from Trump to end joint military maneuvers with the South Koreans is a clear win for NK. Him not mentioning human rights, or insisting on the words "irreversible" or "verifiable" before "denuclearization" is also a win for NK. And note how "denuclearization of the Korean peninsula" includes the american nukes in South Korea. The North Koreans agreeing to a denuclearization at all, on the other hand, is a win for Trump/America. As is NK's commitment to further negotiations.

Overall, today's summit has been a small net victory for NK, but as I explained above, this is ok - for the time being. Yes, I am still concerned that Trump might be signing onto a bad deal in the end because he wants a huge and symbolic foreign policy victory. On the other hand, the fact that the agreement calls for SoS Mike Pompeo to lead the next rounds of negotiations is reassuring.

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Jun 12 2018 09:07am

jesus man you can't start off with historic revisionism then expound on it.....

past presidents didn't want meetings, knowing the Kim's would just use them to propagandize their people. because they used all the meetings to do that even when it was with lowly members of the state dept, they are just photo ops for the Kims.

Trump got a meeting, that's awesome, and he has some effect it's not all happenstance. and this time and place we're at in history may be different, hand Trump a nobel peace prize if the camps shut down and i'll gladly cheer along with /r/T_D. but the lack of basic knowledge on the North Korean situation most people have is just shameful. i can suggest to you any number of books that might help you in this endeavor, lmk.

This post was edited by thesnipa on Jun 12 2018 09:12am

very true, although I wouldnt consider this a criticism of Trump. Imho, just like "only Nixon could go to China", only Trump could meet with the North Koreans.



100% agreed.

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Jun 12 2018 09:12am

1. Past presidents could've had a summit with the North Korean leader, so I'm not sure how the meeting in and of itself is a success. Definitely historic though.
4. I think avoiding the human rights issue was acceptable at this first meeting, and Trump being overtly friendly to the guy seems smart, but his comments since the meeting are troubling. He can be diplomatic without lavishing Kim with praise.

Otherwise, I agree with pretty much everything you said. Now we all know you're a liberal hack disguised as a Trump supporter.

This post was edited by IceMage on Jun 12 2018 09:14am