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Dec 1 2017 04:32pm
Quote (TB12 @ Dec 1 2017 04:19pm)
ALSO

Ya'll jumping to some major conclusions. Flynn calling Russia during the transitional phase isn't illegal. Why he lied about it? No clue. But the act of calling them during the transition phase isn't illegal at all, in fact it's pretty normal. So there needs to be something else before any conclusions can be made.


Because Trump, Flynn, Pence, Kushner all were deceitful about it and tried to conduct it in secrecy to avoid a scandal.
And if Mueller goes around exposing Trump in a lie about Russia, that's a major coup for the democrats.
Which is very conspicuous given how, like you said, its simply not illegal under any enforceable statute or even out of the ordinary, and has bugger all to do with the Russian interference in the campaign.

Which is what worries me into the possibility that Mueller really is a democrat attack dog who has been biding his time
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Dec 1 2017 04:39pm
Quote (Surfpunk @ Dec 1 2017 05:28pm)
LawfareBlog has a good analysis of what this deal with Flynn means: https://lawfareblog.com/flynn-plea-quick-and-dirty-analysis

Very salient point:



In a nutshell, Flynn has NO immunity against other potential charges, so Mueller could bring other things to bear if Flynn decides to back out of whatever deal he has agreed to with him.



From the same article:


Could simply be taking what they can get too.

You have no clue.
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Dec 1 2017 04:40pm
Quote (TB12 @ Dec 1 2017 04:39pm)
Could simply be taking what they can get too.

You have no clue.


why would a prosecutor "take what they can get" and offer a sweat heart deal?
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Dec 1 2017 04:41pm
Quote (thesnipa @ Dec 1 2017 05:40pm)
why would a prosecutor "take what they can get" and offer a sweat heart deal?


Because they have nothing and know they having nothing. So if they get him to throw out some higher level officials they'll take what they can get.

The notion that this is suddenly going to incriminate Trump is ridiculous.
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Dec 1 2017 04:42pm


If Mueller has to stoop to coercing accusations against Trump, then he has nothing.
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Dec 1 2017 04:45pm
Quote (Ghot @ Dec 1 2017 04:42pm)
If Mueller has to stoop to coercing accusations against Trump, then he has nothing.


thats how literally every mob went down, ever. idiot. go read a book on it, you've got time, at least a few more years until you join widow.

Quote (TB12 @ Dec 1 2017 04:41pm)
Because they have nothing and know they having nothing. So if they get him to throw out some higher level officials they'll take what they can get.

The notion that this is suddenly going to incriminate Trump is ridiculous.


that notion isn't ridiculous, at least not as a notion. to claim this proves anything would be ridiculous though. especially given how little we know overall.
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Dec 1 2017 04:45pm
Quote (TB12 @ Dec 1 2017 04:39pm)
Could simply be taking what they can get too.

You have no clue.


Neither do you.

That's the thing though with the deal with Flynn. With the actual evidence they had on Flynn for a number of more serious charges (influence peddling, FARA violations, the plan to kidnap Fethullah Gulen and return him to Turkey, for example), Mueller pretty much had him dead-to-rights. If it was Flynn and just Flynn, Mueller would have no reason to even entertain the thought of a deal with Flynn. The ONLY reason a deal is considered (and this was a sweetheart deal, based on the other stuff Mueller could hit Flynn with), is if Mueller believes the deal will get him a bigger fish. And when you're talking about someone at the level of Flynn (NatSec Advisor), the only "bigger" fish are POTUS and VPOTUS. You have comparable fish, like Kushner, Sessions, but no one else would be bigger, from a prosecutorial standpoint.
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Dec 1 2017 04:49pm
Quote (thesnipa @ Dec 1 2017 05:45pm)
thats how literally every mob went down, ever. idiot. go read a book on it, you've got time, at least a few more years until you join widow.



Your seriously, excessive dislike of Trump is showing through, if you equate the President of the United States with a mob boss.

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Dec 1 2017 04:56pm
Quote (Surfpunk @ Dec 1 2017 04:45pm)
Neither do you.

That's the thing though with the deal with Flynn. With the actual evidence they had on Flynn for a number of more serious charges (influence peddling, FARA violations, the plan to kidnap Fethullah Gulen and return him to Turkey, for example), Mueller pretty much had him dead-to-rights. If it was Flynn and just Flynn, Mueller would have no reason to even entertain the thought of a deal with Flynn. The ONLY reason a deal is considered (and this was a sweetheart deal, based on the other stuff Mueller could hit Flynn with), is if Mueller believes the deal will get him a bigger fish. And when you're talking about someone at the level of Flynn (NatSec Advisor), the only "bigger" fish are POTUS and VPOTUS. You have comparable fish, like Kushner, Sessions, but no one else would be bigger, from a prosecutorial standpoint.


Take it from three vantage points
Say there is some massive collusion conspiracy hidden:
Then Mueller has reason to leverage Flynn to try to get him to squeal about it on Trump

Say Mueller is just searching for the truth of collusion at all costs:
Then Mueller has reason to leverage Flynn as a window into the Trump machine and all its inner workings just so he can honestly search for clues of whether collusion occurred or not, which could be demonstrated by how Russia interacted during the transition

Say Mueller is actually a democratic partisan who knows there is no collusion:
Then by exposing every embarrassing link to Russia undertaken diplomatically and potentially exposing Trump in a lie and maybe being able to bring spurious charges on the Logan Act, the transition period would be a gold mine to exploit.
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Dec 1 2017 04:58pm
Quote (Ghot @ Dec 1 2017 04:49pm)
Your seriously, excessive dislike of Trump is showing through, if you equate the President of the United States with a mob boss.


the link is mueller, not trump-mob boss. lol
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