They did exist, and they continue to exist, its just that you seem to consider them as less then human so the fact that they were living there is not deemed relevant by you. call it Palestine, Israel or Telly Tubby Land, the fact is Israel has been kicking non jewish people out of their homes, for decades. The fact that you deflect away from this is astounding. it is a fact in Gaza and it is a fact in the West Bank.

Forced displacement IS happening, and you can spout whatever you want but ill continue to provide supporting evidence to refute your nonsensical refusal to accept reality.

https://www.unrwa.org/sites/default/files/west_bank_demolitions_factsheet.pdf

https://www.internal-displacement.org/global-report/grid2023/

snippet from 2023 (pre Oct 7th)

Internal displacement in Palestine is among the most protracted in the world, and hostilities and housing demolitions force people from their homes every year.Nearly 1,800 such displacements were recorded in 2022. The most significant event took place in the Gaza Strip in August, when Israeli airstrikes damaged more than 1,700 homes and triggered more than 640 displacements.Around 1,000 were recorded in the West Bank during the year, mostly the result of the demolition of homes. There were around 12,000 people living in internal displacement across Palestine as of the end of the year.

snippet from 2022

Conflict also reignited in Gaza in May, triggering more than 117,000 displacements

Snippet from 2021

Israel declared that it would halt demolitions during the Covid-19 pandemic, but the destruction and confiscation of homes triggered 1,000 new displacements in Palestine.93 In the largest displacement event in more than a
decade, 73 people, including 41 children, were displaced in Humsa al Bqai’a in November when homes and other property, including donor-funded humanitarian shelters, were destroyed. 94 The demolition and confiscation of
homes within Israel also led to 3,000 new displacements among Bedouin and other Arab Israelis

This post was edited by ferdia on Apr 11 2024 03:20am

The UN accuses Israel of hindering food distribution. “Food deliveries coordinated by the UN are far more likely to be obstructed or denied access... than any other humanitarian mission,” said a spokesperson for the Office for the Coordination of Affairs humanitarian organizations (Ocha), Jens Laerke, in Geneva. “Food convoys that are expected to go particularly to the north, where 70% of the population faces famine-like conditions, are three times more likely to be turned away than other humanitarian convoys,” he said. he.

(source; francetvinfo.fr)

The nazis copy-cat at it again.

Israel took west bank from Jordan, That is it.

Get your facts straight, Jews like my family lived in the west bank, the Arabs killed and ethnically cleansed Jews everywhere they sit including the west bank, Jews unlike the Arabs always had collective consciousness.
We took over, we have the power to control it, live with us peacefully or go look for some place else

Your talking to a Jew that his family never left Judea we can count at least 12 generations back, the only thing you refute is in your brain

This post was edited by Many_Names on Apr 11 2024 03:20am

your just deflecting deflecting and deflecting. I provided the facts in the above. As the colonial force, you are trying to rewrite facts and history and have not supplied any evidence to support your claims, while we continue to posts evidence.

the fact is you have collectively punished everyone in Gaza, which is a war crime, and you continue policies of ethnic cleansing in gaza and the west bank.
ill keep going back further and further to provide evidence.

2019-2020

The West Bank, East Jerusalem and Gaza recorded 1,500 new displacements in 2019, bringing the number of IDPs in Palestine as of the end of the year to 243,000. Housing demolitions, forced evictions, the confiscation
of property and acts of violence perpetrated by Israeli settlers and the military all forced people to flee their homes in the West Bank and East Jerusalem. Violence also flared up in Gaza in early May and mid-November,
leading to the destruction of many homes and the displacement of hundreds of people.

source: IDMC GRID 2020.

This post was edited by ferdia on Apr 11 2024 03:24am

You are the one deflecting
Fact is Jordan was in control over west bank, before that it was british mandate and before that it was the ottoman empire
We took west bank from Jordan.

These are facts, the rest is you mumbling with yourself

Lost you in Gaza

We had nothing with Gaza until now.
The rest is pure bullshit

I dont know where do you live but go build an house on a mountain somewhere and tell me what happened

This post was edited by Many_Names on Apr 11 2024 03:27am

https://api.internal-displacement.org/sites/default/files/publications/documents/2019-IDMC-GRID.pdf

1. I am providing evidence, you are not.
2. You are talking about shit from 100 years ago, I am talking about what Israel has been doing since then.
3. You took the west bank from the people living there, and its occupied, not owned.

I have no problem mumbling to myself, maybe can mumble with me, and maybe there will be a 3rd person, and then a 4th, and then 100, and then 1000 and then 1 million people, all saying that what you are doing is wrong.

i will continue:

https://www.unocha.org/publications/report/occupied-palestinian-territory/over-4000-palestinians-displaced-west-bank-2023

snippet:

In 2023, about 4,000 Palestinians were displaced due to policies and practices implemented by the Israeli authorities or Israeli settlers, all contributing to a coercive environment in the West Bank, including East Jerusalem:

A total of 1,152 Palestinians, including 575 children, were displaced when the Israeli authorities demolished or forced them to demolish their homes citing lack of Israeli-issued building permits.
173 Palestinians, including 70 children, were displaced when the Israeli authorities demolished their homes on punitive grounds.
921 Palestinians, including 394 children, were displaced during Israeli forces operations, where 222 structures were destroyed.
At least 1,539 Palestinians, including 756 children, were displaced from their homes or communities in Area C of the West Bank amid Israeli settler violence, access restrictions, and shrinking access to grazing land.
200 Palestinians, including 82 children, were displaced from H2 area and Masafer Yatta in Hebron, citing increased movement restrictions imposed on their communities by Israeli forces as the primary reason.


This is from 2011:

https://www.refworld.org/reference/annualreport/idmc/2011/en/78512

In 2010, there were at least 160,000 IDPs within OPT, who had been forced from their homes during the preceding four decades. They had been displaced by various activities of the Israeli government and army, which indicated a continuing policy of displacing Palestinians and divesting them of ownership rights guaranteed under international law in order to acquire land and redefine demographic boundaries.

Palestinians have been displaced due to Israeli settlement construction, settler violence, Israeli military incursions and clearing operations, evictions, land appropriations and house demolitions, discriminatory denial of building permits, and the revocation of residency rights in East Jerusalem. Many people had also been displaced by violence committed by settlers.

Tens of thousands of people were still displaced within Gaza at the end of 2010, two years after an intense three-week Israeli offensive had destroyed their homes. They were enduring precarious living conditions: many were living in makeshift structures while others were sharing overcrowded facilities with hosts. Their recovery had been hindered by the Israeli government's blockade of Gaza, in particular its refusal to allow in construction materials.

The humanitarian situation in Gaza improved slightly in 2010 as restrictions in place since 2006 were eased, however the blockade continued to stall reconstruction efforts. In 2010, 20,000 people in Gaza displaced in 2008 and 2009 were receiving rental assistance, while an undefined number were still staying with hosts. A further 2,900 families displaced due to previous incursions were still unable to rebuild their homes.

In the West Bank, people became more vulnerable as the illegal expansion of settlements and related infrastructure continued despite an Israeli moratorium on settlement growth. It was also estimated that 100,000 people remained at risk of displacement throughout the West Bank, including 60,000 in East Jerusalem alone. Communities threatened with expulsion or eviction, particularly along the Jordan Valley and south Hebron Hills in the West Bank and in the buffer zone in Gaza, faced harassment, violence and intimidation by Israeli settlers as well as Israeli authorities.

In areas of the West Bank under Israeli administration, including East Jerusalem, almost 600 people were displaced and 14,000 affected when their homes and livelihood related structures were demolished in 2010. The number of demolitions was 60 per cent higher than in 2009. There were no figures on the number of people whose residency in East Jerusalem was revoked during the year.

The Separation Wall has continued to cause restrictions on freedom of movement, and put tens of thousands of people at risk of displacement. The Wall was built beyond the "Green Line" demarcating areas administered as part of the State of Israel since 1949, and though some restrictions were removed in 2010, the continuing system of closures made life untenable for many residents of the enclaves which it had created.

There have been no exercises to profile the internally displaced population or assess their protection and humanitarian needs. IDPs are thought to be dispersed among communities in areas away from Israeli infrastructure. In Gaza, people displaced due to incursions have sought shelter with relatives, or in public buildings or schools until longer-term accommodation becomes possible. IDPs have lost livelihoods and access to social welfare, and families have been separated by displacement. Internally displaced adults and children have faced wide-ranging physical and psychological impacts.

The government of Israel has not generally recognised the internal displacement, even though it remains the primary perpetrator. It does not provide assistance or protection to IDPs. The Palestinian authorities in West Bank and Gaza, despite attempts to address displacement, have been impaired by the ongoing policies of occupation, their limited jurisdiction under the Oslo Accords, political turmoil and poor governance.

Palestinian, Israeli and international NGOs have researched and publicised the impact of house demolitions and the Wall on communities, and sought to prevent displacement, on occasion providing legal and other assistance to victims of eviction orders or demolitions. There is no international agency in OPT with an explicit IDP protection mandate, though several UN agencies have responded within their respective mandates. Nevertheless, the international community has remained largely ineffective in preventing displacement in OPT.

For the vast majority of IDPs in OPT, durable solutions remain tied to the reversal of policies of occupation, and an eventual final resolution to the conflict. Human rights agencies and humanitarian NGOs have long warned that the failure of the international community to address the underlying sources of forced displacement is increasingly rendering any two-state solution unviable. Prioritisation of the rights of those affected is ever more pressing, in light of the demographic changes that displacement entails and the continuing consequences that these changes will have for contested areas.


This post was edited by ferdia on Apr 11 2024 03:31am

I dont need to provide evidence for common knowledge.
Ottoman empire up until 1920
British mandate 1920-1948
Jordan 1948-1967
1967-2024 Israel

Even if 1.9 billion people say I am wrong it doesnt mean I am wrong

This post was edited by Many_Names on Apr 11 2024 03:33am

"fake news" apparently.

This post was edited by ferdia on Apr 11 2024 03:52am

The video is also false its states as if we pushed the Arabs into the west bank… but we didnt there are Arabs in acco, haifa, lod, tora, tybe, and many other cities.
They came to fight us not vice versa Nakba is self induced

Here is something you ignorants doesnt even bother to learn.

I am a left wing Israeli, and I disclosed my own political stance, so it’ll become clear that even an Israeli with the political views I hold, very much understands that there are Palestinians today, and there is a Palestinian ethnic group with claims for a state of their own, which is fine in the land they currently poses and not on my expanse.

Even if Israel will cease to exist tomorrow (God forbid), and the land will be given to an Arab country or divided between the neighboring Arab countries to control - Palestinian nationalism is such a strong force, that it’ll be a headache even for an Arab country which culture, language and religion are virtually identical to that of the Palestinians to rid off. A good example for this is Jordan - just ask them about “Black September”, 1970. Or Lebanon.

Anyone who denies the fact that today there’s a Palestinian nation, an ethnic group that strongly identifies itself as Palestinians, is either blind or has been living under a rock for the past 50–60 years.

Secondly, the issue that needs to be dealt with, isn’t the existence of the Palestinians or the existence of Palestinian ethnicity and nationalism. The question is - when did the forefathers of the Palestinians decide that they are one, and what was the motivation - was it simply a natural development of a unique group of people that sought recognition and self-determination? Or was it the result of a deliberate, elaborated, longest hatred campaign and practically a crime against humanity by subjugating generations of millions of people to a delusional adventure with the sole purpose to destroy and erase any Jewish presence in the land that is modern Israel?

The forefathers of modern Palestinians had nothing unique about them, that justifies defining them as an ethnic group, when judged in the context of the rest of the Levant and Middle East, as late as 70 years ago.

They were Arab speaking Levantine Muslims with substantial Christian minority among them - typical to the rest of the Levant, and their internal divisions can still be seen, although these divisions are overshadowed nowadays by Palestinian nationalism:



Rural Palestinians - Falaheen which usually worked lands that belonged to rich people - effendis - which lived in Damascus or other cities in the region that provided better quality of life. There was little to no difference between a Falah in rural region of South Syria and North Israel - they even spoke the same dialect most of the times.
Urban Palestinians - Madani which lived in the few urban centers in the lands that have become Israel and the Palestinian-governed disputed territories (Judea and Samaria and Gaza).
Bedouins - nomadic Arab speaking tribes which saw themselves as somewhat superior to the inferior Falaheen and Urban dwellers.
On top of these, there were even more divisions:

Division by Hamula - hamula is basically a clan or an extended family which a person belongs to in the Arab society - many of these clans have no relation to geo-political divisions (ie country borders) - there are many clans that spread few several villages and towns - for example, a very famous clan in Israel is the Zoabi clan, they have members from Northern Israel all the way to Syria. Many Palestinians belonged to such clans and still do to this day. This clan division also sometimes bring about cycles of blood feud between rivaling clans. Different clans have different reputation in the society, with some clans being considered respectful, and others poor and insignificant.
Division by religion - this is the most obvious division which is still very much alive today - Christians were divided by the different rivaling denominations, Muslims were also divided, you had Druze, etc.
Division by ethnic origins - as in other places in the Levant and the Middle East, there were also ethnic minorities among the Arab speaking population that became the Palestinians - Circassians, Bosnians, Sudanese Arabs etc. To this day dark skinned Palestinians from African origins are looked at as foreigners, despite the fact that they’ve been living in the region for almost 200 years (if not before), and Circassians do not view themselves as Palestinians at all.
These divisions were the dominating identities which the forefathers of the Palestinians would have used to define themselves. In a larger extent, they might, just might, view themselves as part of Al-Sham - which was the synonym for this region:



It’s name was Bilad Al-Sham, which was used for that territory seen in the map above by the Fatimid, Rashidun and Abbasid Caliphates until the end of the 10th century AD.

After the Crusader states and the Kingdom of Jerusalem have been overthrown in the 12th century AD, the region was divided between Aleppo centered “Northern Syria” and Damascus-centered “Southern Syria” by the consequential empires that ruled the region (the short lived Ayyubid caliphate and later Mamluk Sultanese centered in Cairo).

Then, when the Ottomans took over, they’ve initially created this eyalet (province in Ottoman Turkish) and called it, il-Sham:



Then in 1549 it was re-organized into two separate eyalets. The northern Sanjak of Aleppo became the center of the new Eyalet of Aleppo. At this time, the two Syrian Eyalets were subdivided as follows:

The Eyalet of Aleppo (Arabic: إيالة حلب‎)

The Sanjak of Aleppo (حلب)
The Sanjak of Adana (أضنة)
The Sanjak of Ablistan (Marash (مرعش))
The Sanjak of Aintab (عينتاب)
The Sanjak of Birejik (البيرة) (Urfa (أورفة))
The Sanjak of Kilis (كلز)
The Sanjak of Ma'arra (معرة النعمان)
The Sanjak of Hama (حماة)
The Sanjak of Salamiyah (سلمية)
The Sanjak of Homs (حمص)
The Eyalet of Damascus (Arabic: إيالة دمشق‎)

The Sanjak of Damascus (دمشق)
The Sanjak of Tripoli (طرابلس)
The Sanjak of Acre (عكا)
The Sanjak of Safad (صفد)
The Sanjak of Nablus (نابلس)
The Sanjak of Jerusalem (القدس)
The Sanjak of Lajjun (اللجون)
The Sanjak of Salt (السلط)
The Sanjak of Gaza (غزة)
As you can see, still no sanjak or eyalet that can somehow unify the forefathers of the Palestinians into a separate people from the other Levantine Arabs.

Even as late as 1872, up until the end of WW1 (1918), this was the political division of the Eyalet of Damascus:

Aleppo Vilayet (Arabic: ولاية حلب‎)
Sanjak of Zor (Arabic: سنجق دير الزور‎)
Beirut Vilayet (Arabic: ولاية بيروت‎)
Syria Vilayet (Arabic: ولاية سورية‎)
Mutasarrifate of Mount Lebanon (Arabic: متصرفية جبل لبنان‎)
Mutasarrifate of Jerusalem (Arabic: متصرفية القدس الشريف‎)
Mutasarrifate of Karak (from 1895) (Arabic: متصرفية الكرك‎)
This is how the map of these subdivisions looked like:



The political status of the Mutasarrifate of Jerusalem was unique to other Ottoman province since it came under the direct authority of the Ottoman capital Constantinople - this wasn’t because the Ottomans recognized that the inhabitants of Jerusalem were a unique ethnic group of course, but was part of the Tanzimat reforms which wanted to ease the tensions in the empire, one of which was the foreign powers claim to all sorts of religious minorities and the holy places in the Holy Land.

The first Arabic national movements of that region were also, as it’s naturally assumed, Syrian in nature, and sought to liberate the entire region of what was called Eyalet Al-Sham from the Ottomans into an Arabic independent state. These ideas were gaining more and more support among the elites in all of Syria, especially around the turn of the 19th century, beginning of the 20th century.

At the same time, other ideas of nationalism among the Arabs were more encompassing, seeking to create a pan-Arabic Middle Eastern state.

However nowhere, even during those times of the birth of Arabic nationalism, anyone suggested that there’s a separate ethnicity of nation called Palestinians - they were viewed as Al-Sham inhabitants, or Syrians (or South Syrians).

Even when the British created the Mandate of Palestine following WW1, the Arab speaking population didn’t see themselves as unique and separated from their Al-Sham brethren, and saw the name Palestine as a colonial division (which it really was, as it was an artificial entity established by a colonial power).

At the same time, starting from later 19th century, with the increasing immigration of Jews back to the Holy Land Joining their own people and beginning of Zionism, there began an Arab resentment towards the Jews among some circles of society. In the beginning, it was mostly fueled by traditional Muslim antisemitism, but over time the nationalists start viewing the Jews as a threat to their own national aspirations to create an independent Syria that will rule all over Syria (Al-Sham).

This hatred would be the shaping force of Palestinian nationalism and ethnic identity - as the Arabs of the Mandate of Palestine would be rallied by their leadership in incitement against Jews. This would all culminate into 1948. When the Arabs lost, and were unable to destroy the young Israel, they had a problem - what to do with all the Al-Sham Arabs from the areas that have now became Israel?

Their solution was to put them, without political and usually without basic human rights, in refugee camps, and abuse and use these poor people as a tool, a political weapon, against Israel. This policy of distinguishing those Al-Sham Arabs from the previous territory that the British named Mandate of Palestine by the other countries that were formed from Al-Sham - Syria, Lebanon and Jordan - could be viewed as the ethnogenesis of Palestinian ethnicity.

As can be seen, this was an artificial, pre-meditated move, as these people basically were no different whatsoever from other Syrian, Lebanese or Jordanian Arabic speaking people. Even the way they internally divided their own society was exactly the same - and had nothing to do with the geography of the Mandate of Palestine.

Adding more to it - up until the late 1960s and early 1970s, when the dream of a pan-Arabic Syria had began to be seen as not achievable, many Palestinian nationalist didn’t even aspire for a separate Palestine - they did aspire to liberate the lands taken by the Jews in order to create Al-Sham. However, by that time, a generation after the Arab refugees that have became known as “Palestinians”, the train has already left the station - and a new ethnic group was born.

This is the real tragedy - the Palestinian ethnicity and nation identity was forged by antisemitism, manipulation by the Arab League, and needless suffering of the forefathers of the Palestinian people.

And this is one of the reasons why peace between Israel and the Palestinians is so hard to achieve

Fact stays you have no idea what you are talking about your teachers are youtube videos and Palestinian propaganda


This post was edited by Many_Names on Apr 11 2024 04:09am