No - I benefited from publicly funded education and healthcare during my formative years so I'm happy to pay it back to fund the next generation

This is riddled with fallacies.

The state being one method of enforcement of property rights does not mean it is the only one, nor does it somehow make property theft.

The state and taxation are not requirements for property.

Property removes my right to use something I otherwise would have the right to use. How is that not theft?

Scenario A: I walk up to an apple tree. Take the apple. Eat it.

Scenario B: You walk up to an apple tree, build a house next to it, and then claim the land as yours and say it's your apples. I can't eat from the tree.

Seems like you stole apples from me.

This post was edited by Thor123422 on May 21 2021 03:58pm

Yes the state and taxation currently exist.
This doesn't particularly address the point.



Government taking people's money/income/wealth does in fact leave them in a worse material position.

Theft remains theft, even if the thief promises to spend some of your money on something that ostensibly helps you.


Some individuals' desire to use some government services does not prove taxation isn't theft.
The state currently monopolizes a number of services.



'I'm happy so its not theft' is a very bad argument.

Because someone owning something is not the same as stealing your property.
My house is not yours.
I am not aggressing upon you or taking anything from you by owning the computer I am typing this on.

There is no right to steal and use other people's stuff.

You are assuming the right to private property is the default state of being. It isn't.

In a world where nobody "claims" anything, the first person to exclude others and create property is a thief. That is the origin of all property.

This post was edited by Thor123422 on May 21 2021 04:03pm

This presupposes everything is already everyone's property. Its not.

This post was edited by cambovenzi on May 21 2021 04:04pm

Wrong. It supposes nothing is anybody's property, and therefore you have no right to exclude others.

Taking something that belongs to no one is not stealing. You called them a thief. You are wrong as usual.

The time for deflecting from the fact that taxation is theft is now over.

That is ultimately just a matter of definition. I don't see taking something that doesn't belong to you and threatening violence against others who want to use it without their consent as meaningfully different from theft or stealing.

I'd actually go a step further and say it's functionally no different from theft. When you steal from somebody you take something they had the right to use and exclude them from it.

Ultimately who "has the right to use something" (owns something) is a matter of the rules of that society, and our society we say "you get to have private property as long as you pay in according to the rules and acquired it in a way congruent with the rules". There is no way to separate property from taxation in our society.

This post was edited by Thor123422 on May 21 2021 04:16pm