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Mar 3 2020 01:29pm
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Mar 3 2020 01:21pm)
Thx for making these threads btw, much appreciated! :)

Until two days ago, I expected Bernie to win big tonight and to head into the convention with a plurality of the delegates. After the massive circling of the wagons around Biden over the last two days, I'm not so sure anymore.

One important point to keep in mind when results are coming in tonight: Biden's best states lie mostly in the eastern half of the country, while Bernie's lie in the west; and there will be lots of late-arriving mail ballots coming over the next couple of days in California, which tend to skew young and independent, i.e. favoring Sanders. So Bernie's final results in CA will most definitely be better than the results we'll get to see tonight. So it's likely that the narrative you'll hear on CNN et al. will undersell Bernie's true performance.


i think "biden = south + center, sanders = coasts" would be more accurate. but we'll see how it breaks down.
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Mar 3 2020 01:31pm
Quote (thesnipa @ 3 Mar 2020 20:29)
i think "biden = south + center, sanders = coasts" would be more accurate. but we'll see how it breaks down.


You're right, Bernie is strong in New England. It's just that the South (including NC and VA) have a lot more delegates at stake tonight than those in the North East.
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Mar 3 2020 01:31pm
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/485714-comey-endorses-biden-there-is-a-reason-trump-fears-biden-and-roots-for
Comey endorses Biden; campaign says no thanks

Mr. Irrelevant keeps trying to stay in the spotlight -_-
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Mar 3 2020 01:39pm
Quote (excellence @ Mar 3 2020 01:31pm)
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/485714-comey-endorses-biden-there-is-a-reason-trump-fears-biden-and-roots-for
Comey endorses Biden; campaign says no thanks

Mr. Irrelevant keeps trying to stay in the spotlight -_-


I can't believe that Comey hasn't been suicide'd yet.
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Mar 3 2020 01:45pm
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Mar 3 2020 01:31pm)
You're right, Bernie is strong in New England. It's just that the South (including NC and VA) have a lot more delegates at stake tonight than those in the North East.


ahh yeah i see what you mean. moving forward looks like it will come down to battleground states with the south going to biden and new england and the west/northwest going to bernie wholesale.
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Mar 3 2020 01:48pm
I understand it's important for a candidate to have a broad coalition of support and pure numbers behind them for potential governing purposes, but personally I don't care too much how Bernie does in California and Texas or how Biden does in the Deep South.

Those states are already decided one way or another in this particular general election. Clinton beat Sanders in part in 2016 due to cleaning up in the South, all states that Democrats were not winning anyways.

The Midwest and swing States intrigue me the most, and I see Sanders doing better in some and Biden doing better in some others. That's what I am interested in seeing today. Thus, Virginia and North Carolina pique my interest the most.

Agree with Black Xistenz as above. Sanders was looking like a big favorite, but the events over the past few days cloud things. I actually think Biden is the favorite now in light of everything. Vegas odds actually favor him. I think Biden is the nominee.
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Mar 3 2020 01:54pm
Quote (ThatAlex @ Mar 3 2020 01:48pm)
I understand it's important for a candidate to have a broad coalition of support and pure numbers behind them for potential governing purposes, but personally I don't care too much how Bernie does in California and Texas or how Biden does in the Deep South.

Those states are already decided one way or another in this particular general election. Clinton beat Sanders in part in 2016 due to cleaning up in the South, all states that Democrats were not winning anyways.

The Midwest and swing States intrigue me the most, and I see Sanders doing better in some and Biden doing better in some others. That's what I am interested in seeing today. Thus, Virginia and North Carolina pique my interest the most.

Agree with Black Xistenz as above. Sanders was looking like a big favorite, but the events over the past few days cloud things. I actually think Biden is the favorite now in light of everything. Vegas odds actually favor him. I think Biden is the nominee.


this is the problem with general vs primary politics. if its a vote state by state its imperfect, but if the party hand picked a candidate based on who can compete with Trump on an electoral map they'd be rightfully lambasted for acting undemocratically. its a real fucking pickle.

i am curious of your opinion on a state by state basis where u think Biden and Sanders hold an edge as far as the midwest. with some simple reasons. if u have time, nothing longform req'd.
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Mar 3 2020 02:10pm
Quote (thesnipa @ 3 Mar 2020 12:54)
this is the problem with general vs primary politics. if its a vote state by state its imperfect, but if the party hand picked a candidate based on who can compete with Trump on an electoral map they'd be rightfully lambasted for acting undemocratically. its a real fucking pickle.

i am curious of your opinion on a state by state basis where u think Biden and Sanders hold an edge as far as the midwest. with some simple reasons. if u have time, nothing longform req'd.


It's mainly based on state demographics. Sanders will likely do better in the Midwest in states like Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, and Michigan. Whereas Biden will likely do better in North Carolina and Virginia. Biden will probably do better in Florida and Arizona as well.

Overall, I think Biden is the safer pick based on this initial polling data. He does better than Sanders in most swing states.

However, like we mentioned, the primary is a different game than the general. I do think Sanders is a riskier pick, but I think he has more potential to upset Trump. I'm concerned that Biden's ceiling isn't as high. Sanders is the more intriguing pick imo, I think there is a window of possibility where he produces massive Dem turnout and beats Trump.
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Mar 3 2020 02:13pm
Quote (ThatAlex @ Mar 3 2020 02:10pm)
It's mainly based on state demographics. Sanders will likely do better in the Midwest in states like Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, and Michigan. Whereas Biden will likely do better in North Carolina and Virginia. Biden will probably do better in Florida and Arizona as well.

Overall, I think Biden is the safer pick based on this initial polling data. He does better than Sanders in most swing states.

However, like we mentioned, the primary is a different game than the general. I do think Sanders is a riskier pick, but I think he has more potential to upset Trump. I'm concerned that Biden's ceiling isn't as high. Sanders is the more intriguing pick imo, I think there is a window of possibility where he produces massive Dem turnout and beats Trump.


in light of the recent drop outs im predicting a Biden win in Wisconsin as well. too many unions that wont vote for universal healthcare as a prio 1 issue. but i think it will be close.
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Mar 3 2020 02:20pm
Quote (thesnipa @ 3 Mar 2020 20:54)
this is the problem with general vs primary politics. if its a vote state by state its imperfect, but if the party hand picked a candidate based on who can compete with Trump on an electoral map they'd be rightfully lambasted for acting undemocratically. its a real fucking pickle.

i am curious of your opinion on a state by state basis where u think Biden and Sanders hold an edge as far as the midwest. with some simple reasons. if u have time, nothing longform req'd.


Not directed at me, but I actually wrote about this in some detail, so I'll quote myself in case anyone is interested:


Quote (myself)
When it comes to Bernie vs Biden: Bernie's entire rationale for beating Trump is predicated on huge turnout of progressive, young and/or latino voters. Until now, this turnout hasnt really materialized. Iowa and Nevada had mediocre turnout, and the one in New Hampshire was mostly high because of their open primary system where GOP members could cast a vote in the Democratic primaries (note that the GOP didnt have a competitive primary in contrast to 2016). But we'll have to wait and see what happens tomorrow on Super Tuesday.

Furthermore, I would argue that Bernie's coalition is less efficiently positioned in the electoral college. Bernie is really strong in California, Oregon, Washington and the North East, he also might be strong in Nevada and Michigan. But places where he is decidedly weaker than nationally are Florida, North Carolina and Pennsylvania. Biden, on the other hand, is a lot stronger and Florida and Pennsylvania, and he might also have the edge over Trump in Michigan and Wisconsin. What it boils down to, imho, is that Bernie needs to flip Arizona (well possible) and Texas (that's a huge mountain to climb). Biden, on the other hand, will be very competitive in North Carolina and might even make a play for Georgia.


https://forums.d2jsp.org/topic.php?t=80773490&f=119&p=555521879#p555521879


Pennsylvania in particular is a state which is demographically dominated by rural and/or working-class whites as well as blacks in and around Philly. So Biden seems like a much better fit for PA than Sanders. And Biden has ties to the state, being from Scranton and all that.
Florida is another pivotal state where I see Biden relatively strong and Sanders relatively weak. FL has a ton of older voters, which are Bernie's weakest demographic, it has a relatively high share of African Americans, and Sanders' praise for Cuba and Castro will not go down well AT ALL with Cuban Americans, which are a powerful voting bloc in the state.

On the other hand, I think that Bernie should be quite strong in Michigan. No idea about Iowa, Minnesota and Wisconsin. Ohio will not be a battleground state, Trump has it in the bag (if he doesnt, he's more than finished anyway).

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Mar 3 2020 02:21pm
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