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Apr 26 2023 04:39pm
Quote (caswallen @ Apr 26 2023 03:29pm)
because the money he gives the briber is less than the money he knows he will get from the presidents and bribers assets


True; however I doubt anybody would want to risk 40 years of imprisonment plus seizure of all his assets to become a briber. The price is too high. The mastermind would literally have to pay the briber an insane amount of money. It doesn't matter that he can in theory get a cut from the mastermind. Besides, a portion of the money he would get actually comes from his own assets. It just doesn't sound like a good way to make money. Further, the president and the third party probably don't have enough assets to make this worthwhile, either. And then there is also the risk of the mastermind reneging.

If I gave you 50 million dollars to you to bribe your president, and then promise you that once you are out of jail 40 years later, you will get a lot of money from me. Would you do it?

This post was edited by JessiWan on Apr 26 2023 04:48pm
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Apr 26 2023 04:57pm
Sounds like Sci-fi
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Apr 26 2023 05:03pm
Quote (JessiWan @ Apr 26 2023 04:39pm)
True; however I doubt anybody would want to risk 40 years of imprisonment plus seizure of all his assets to become a briber. The price is too high. The mastermind would literally have to pay the briber an insane amount of money. It doesn't matter that he can in theory get a cut from the mastermind. Besides, a portion of the money he would get actually comes from his own assets. It just doesn't sound like a good way to make money. Further, the president and the third party probably don't have enough assets to make this worthwhile, either. And then there is also the risk of the mastermind reneging.

If I gave you 50 million dollars to you to bribe your president, and then promise you that once you are out of jail 40 years later, you will get a lot of money from me. Would you do it?


no but i could anonymously pay the briber to commit the bribe
then I could get another person completely loyal to me, to "tip off" the goverment
and that person gets all the assets, completely seperate from me, so that I would never be caught
then marry that person, and then me and that sexy woman who tipped off the government live in the bahama's forever with the presidents money


the perfect heist
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Apr 26 2023 05:06pm
Quote (caswallen @ Apr 26 2023 04:03pm)
no but i could anonymously pay the briber to commit the bribe
then I could get another person completely loyal to me, to "tip off" the goverment
and that person gets all the assets, completely seperate from me, so that I would never be caught
then marry that person, and then me and that sexy woman who tipped off the government live in the bahama's forever with the presidents money


the perfect heist


Well, I will not engage in the speculation of events that might happen. No solutions are ever completely safe from manipulation. I just know that it would be better if we implemented what I suggested, than if we didn't.
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Apr 26 2023 05:08pm
Quote (JessiWan @ Apr 26 2023 05:06pm)
Well, I will not engage in the speculation of events that might happen. No solutions are ever completely safe from manipulation. I just know that it would be better if we implemented what I suggested, than if we didn't.


yes but we would be implementing a flawed system that could be exploited by anyone with a heist mentality

the heist mastermind will always exploit a flawed system
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Apr 26 2023 05:14pm
Quote (caswallen @ Apr 26 2023 04:08pm)
yes but we would be implementing a flawed system that could be exploited by anyone with a heist mentality

the heist mastermind will always exploit a flawed system


If we didn't implement it, heist masterminds would still be around to exploit our system; except that the system we would have would be even more flawed.

You can't throw out a suggestion just because it could be exploited. Anything, any plan, any system, can be subverted. Just because you can think of ways to exploit it, it doesn't mean it's not a good suggestion.
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Apr 26 2023 05:19pm
The days of out and out provable bribery are nearly gone, the current corruption is not easy to prove since it is mostly quid pro quo, "I appoint you to this position, you follow my agenda" "You pass this bill for me you walk out of politics and into a $800,000 a year consulting role with my corporation" "You help me win this election i will look the other way while you take ukraine".
So its unlikely any president will get caught being bribed.

This post was edited by Plaguefear on Apr 26 2023 05:19pm
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Apr 26 2023 05:22pm
Quote (Plaguefear @ Apr 26 2023 04:19pm)
The days of out and out provable bribery are nearly gone, the current corruption is not easy to prove since it is mostly quid pro quo, "I appoint you to this position, you follow my agenda" "You pass this bill for me you walk out of politics and into a $800,000 a year consulting role with my corporation" "You help me win this election i will look the other way while you take ukraine".
So its unlikely any president will get caught being bribed.


You have a point. So, in your opinion, what can we do to combat the kind of corruption you speak of?
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Apr 26 2023 05:30pm
Quote (JessiWan @ Apr 27 2023 09:22am)
You have a point. So, in your opinion, what can we do to combat the kind of corruption you speak of?


Generous pensions and the inability to work in the private sector for 10 years after high level public service.
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Apr 27 2023 06:20pm
Quote (JessiWan @ 27 Apr 2023 08:07)
Hello. I like to observe what's wrong with governments and then try to come up with solutions. Not saying I will ever have the power to change anything, nevertheless it's fun. And today I wish to talk about how to prevent presidents from being bribed. I say that Americans should impose incredibly harsh sentences on a president and the person bribing him. I mean a minimum sentence of 40 years imprisonment if they are found guilty. I believe this would work because of the nature of the people involved. Unlike the average people who sometimes commit crimes out of passion or other forms of impulses, the president and the would-be briber are rational. They know what they are doing and they know the risks involved. And they have calculated that the odds of being caught and the resulting punishment are small compared to what they will get if the corrupt deal goes through. So, if we tell them that now there would be an extremely harsh sentence, this should greatly reduce the instances of presidential bribery. And if they try to bypass the law by going through a third-party, for example, if the briber goes to the president's spouse or his son, and then give money to this third-party, there will be an even harsher punishment. I say life imprisonment for all parties involved for trying to circumvent the law like that. And not only that, all three people's assets will be seized by the government. All this money will be awarded to and divided between the person who tipped off the authority about this deal, and the person who provided evidence to help the authority successfully prosecute the criminals. And if these two people are the same person, then he gets all of the money. This way, people know that not only will they be doing the right thing, they will also get quite wealthy rooting out corruption. This will work better than the authority working alone to try to catch bad people. This huge financial award will really incentivize people to watch presidents and would-be bribers like a hawk.

So, what do you think of my idea?


Your idea of imposing incredibly harsh sentences on presidents and bribe-givers to prevent presidential bribery raises some important points to consider. However, it is worth noting that harsh sentences alone may not be enough to deter corruption in government, and there are potential drawbacks to this approach.

Firstly, the effectiveness of harsh sentences as a deterrent is not always clear. Research has shown that the certainty and swiftness of punishment, rather than the severity, can be more effective in preventing criminal behavior. Therefore, simply imposing harsh sentences may not be enough to stop corruption if the chances of getting caught and punished are perceived to be low.

Secondly, it is important to consider the potential consequences of such severe punishments on the justice system and society as a whole. Imposing mandatory minimum sentences of 40 years could lead to over-criminalization and over-punishment of individuals who may not necessarily deserve such severe sentences. This could also have a disproportionate impact on certain communities, particularly those already marginalized by the justice system.

Thirdly, incentivizing people to report on government officials and offering financial rewards for such reporting could also lead to false accusations and a culture of mistrust. It is important to strike a balance between encouraging transparency and accountability and avoiding a witch-hunt mentality that could undermine trust in government institutions.

In conclusion, while imposing harsh sentences on corrupt officials and bribe-givers may be one way to deter corruption, it is important to consider the potential drawbacks and to look at a range of approaches to prevent and address corruption in government. These may include strengthening transparency and accountability measures, promoting a culture of ethics and integrity, and providing effective channels for reporting and addressing corrupt behavior.

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