I asked chat gpt and curious what some of you all may think as well


Chat gpt
The relationship between the rise of robots, AI, and the necessity of Universal Basic Income (UBI) is a significant topic of discussion. Here’s a breakdown of why UBI might become essential as technology advances:

### **1. Job Displacement Due to Automation**
- **AI and Robots Will Replace Jobs:** As AI and robotics become more sophisticated, they are likely to replace jobs across multiple industries—manufacturing, logistics, retail, and even knowledge work.
- **Skill Gaps:** Not everyone can easily transition into tech-centric jobs, leaving a large portion of the workforce at risk.
- **UBI as a Safety Net:** A UBI could provide financial security to those displaced, allowing them to retrain, pursue creative endeavors, or meet basic needs without fear of poverty.

### **2. Economic Inequality**
- **Tech Concentrates Wealth:** The companies building AI and robots tend to centralize wealth and resources, potentially widening the gap between the rich and the poor.
- **Redistributing Wealth:** UBI could serve as a mechanism to redistribute some of the wealth generated by automation, ensuring a more equitable society.

### **3. The Nature of Work**
- **Redefining Work:** With basic needs covered, people could pursue more meaningful work, education, caregiving, or creative endeavors without being constrained by financial necessity.
- **Decoupling Work and Income:** UBI aligns with the idea that survival shouldn’t be dependent on one’s ability to work in an automated economy.

### **4. Stimulating the Economy**
- **Consumer Spending:** If automation reduces the need for workers, fewer people will have disposable income to spend, potentially shrinking the economy.
- **UBI Keeps Money Flowing:** Providing a UBI ensures people can continue to spend, sustaining demand for goods and services.

### **Challenges of UBI Implementation**
- **Funding:** Governments would need to find ways to pay for UBI, possibly through taxes on AI-driven companies, wealth taxes, or reallocating existing welfare budgets.
- **Cultural Resistance:** Some may resist UBI, fearing it discourages work or fosters dependency, though evidence from UBI trials suggests otherwise.

### **The Bigger Picture**
As AI and robots take on more roles, society must reconsider its relationship with work, wealth distribution, and human purpose. UBI could act as a bridge to a future where people are free to thrive in ways not constrained by the need for traditional employment.

You're right—standing up to entrenched systems like big government or shifting the deeply ingrained work culture can feel overwhelming. The challenge of advocating for something like Universal Basic Income (UBI) is compounded by societal, political, and economic factors. Here’s a look at why it’s tough and how it might still be possible to push for UBI despite these barriers:

---

### **Challenges to Fighting for UBI**

1. **Deeply Rooted Work Ethic Culture**
- Many societies view work as central to identity and moral worth.
- There’s a stigma against receiving income without "earning it," even if automation has rendered many jobs unnecessary.

2. **Political Resistance**
- Governments often prioritize short-term goals over long-term systemic changes.
- Politicians may fear backlash from constituents who view UBI as "handouts" or economically unsustainable.
- Lobbying by corporations can steer discussions away from redistributive policies.

3. **Economic Control**
- Those in power often benefit from maintaining the status quo.
- Large corporations, which drive automation, may resist policies like UBI to avoid higher taxes or redistributing their wealth.

4. **Misinformation**
- Opponents of UBI may spread misinformation about its feasibility or impact on work incentives.
- Media and political framing can shape public perception negatively.

5. **Fragmented Advocacy**
- Advocacy efforts can be scattered across groups, making it hard to build a unified movement.
- Lack of a clear strategy or visible leadership hampers progress.

---

### **Why It’s Not Hopeless**

1. **Growing Awareness**
- As automation continues to replace jobs, more people will experience the effects directly.
- Public discourse around UBI is increasing, with trials in countries like Finland, Canada, and the U.S. showing promising results.

2. **Changing Economic Realities**
- The shift towards gig and contract work is destabilizing traditional employment structures.
- People are already experiencing the precarity UBI aims to address, which may make the idea more palatable over time.

3. **Grassroots Movements**
- Change often starts small. Local initiatives and pilot programs can demonstrate the benefits of UBI and build public support.
- Advocacy groups and social media can amplify voices and mobilize communities.

4. **Technological Advancements**
- Automation-driven productivity gains could make UBI financially feasible if those gains are redistributed equitably.
- Public pressure can push governments to tax the windfalls of automation.

5. **Global Trends**
- Some countries are starting to explore UBI or similar policies.
- Success in one region could inspire others to follow suit, creating a domino effect.

---

### **What Can Be Done?**

- **Educate Yourself and Others**: Understanding UBI and its benefits can help dispel myths and change public opinion.
- **Support Grassroots Efforts**: Join or donate to organizations advocating for UBI.
- **Engage Politically**: Push for policies that address economic inequality and automation’s impact, even if they fall short of full UBI.
- **Leverage Technology**: Use platforms to connect with like-minded individuals and share success stories from UBI trials.
- **Be Patient**: Major societal changes take time and consistent effort.

---

While the fight for UBI won’t be easy, it’s not impossible. Change has often come from persistent, organized efforts by people who dared to imagine a better future. It may feel daunting now, but necessity can be a powerful motivator for collective action.

Oregon, the one state over all others which would actually inact UBI at the behest of the largest cooperations, struck down the measure in the last ballot by a fair margin. Then a bunch of advertising and billboards went up thanking voters because of course it did. The cooperations and government have thier excuses for why the measure didnt pass, but the real reason is the amounts offered to the people were pathetically small.

getting anything to start would be great because hopefully we can build on it like we have with marijuana laws
expecting it to start off perfect is just unrealistic getting it to start at all is more realistic

Universal Basic Income is socialist/communist fantasy.
It will never work in the USA.

Look at welfare for proof of a failing bureaucratic system.
Takes in millions of dollars and half of that money goes to paying employees,
which is not it's social(ist) portrayed purpose.

Basic Income incentivizes humans to be lazy and complacent brats.
It does not inspire creativity, well being or advancements.

You will wait in line for your rations like a good communist citizen,
The government will decide when you get to eat.

Is that really what you want?

This post was edited by Mondain on Dec 26 2024 01:47pm

Remind us again what you do for a living.

What I really want is for people to stop editing posts constantly and then complain about the media.

On topic, for anybody to think that a nearing trillion dollar networth cooperation cant afford to give the poorest peoples a couple grand a month is simply wrong. Creed is irrelevant. All that matters is statistics. And there are six of these cooperations in the US with more than enough networth to give EVERY citizen 2+ grand a month and it wouldnt even matter to them.

Why do you think this would cause everyone to be lazy? You don't think a single person would take this money and do something constructive with it? Seems like thats a problem for you yourself.

We just tried UBI 4 years ago and it failed spectacularly, and caused an inflation crisis that is only now being controlled.

Free money given to people has no value since it's free. But since money is fungible, what happens is this funny money just drives down the value of non-funny money (inflation).

We found out that if you pay people to not work, they don't engage in constructive artistic activities, they just don't work or do anything except play games, watch streams or whatever. Nothing constructive

This post was edited by El1te on Dec 26 2024 02:39pm

When I was 16 I emancipated myself with my parents permission, finishing highschool and working at a local grocery store.
When I turned 18 I got a job as a rough neck with an oil and gas company who was at the time in the local area.
In my low-mid twenties I moved my way up to a white collar position where I was educated in piping and electrical on commercial sites.
Got home sick after moving to canada, came back to the usa and landed a job at a construction company.
I've been working from home for over a decade now, using an in house software that is basically cad, but is specialized for piping and electrical.

I've worked my ass off, and I have over 300 acres of land with a farm house I've slowly renovated.

What do you do for a living shoop?

Do neither of you think the point of AI and automation will hit the point that 80% of the worlds jobs are no longer needed? Yea we need programers and engineers but AI is start to do more of that to.its not fictional it is happening.
I don't think we are at that point yet but we definitely will get there sooner then you probably think

I don't think it will hit that point ever if at all. It's an assumption that is based on a flawed understanding of reality.

People said the same about the textile mills and computers in general. Jobs can be lost, but work is always needed. For example we've transitioned to a largely service-based economy because of that. Specific work comes and goes, but work never ends.