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Oct 6 2008 05:19am
did my tests and had a different result wink.gif

and do me a favor, link the test
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Oct 6 2008 05:22am
Quote (Ancalagon @ Mon, 6 Oct 2008, 07:19)
did my tests and had a different result wink.gif

and do me a favor, link the test


It was tested. So I'm assuming that it it correct.

Stop trying to prove me wrong, please, it is not necessary.
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Oct 6 2008 05:35am
explain pls ias-fpa thingies, i dont know
how much ias do i need to reach different frames?
nice guide anyway, i'd put less points on res cold, more on lightning
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Oct 6 2008 05:38am
Quote (WoeToYouOhEarthAndSea @ Mon, 6 Oct 2008, 07:35)
explain pls ias-fpa thingies, i dont know
how much ias do i need to reach different frames?
nice guide anyway, i'd put less points on res cold, more on lightning


6 fpa is the fastest possible smite speed.

It was tested through a calculator. I just cannot link you to it as it would be an external link sad.gif
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Oct 6 2008 05:44am
joost google "titanseal speedcalc english"
@ undyinggod

it was tested by people that you mention with the result that it does not work

I know of tests by other people resulting in the fact that it does work
I did my own tests that came up with that same result

and seriously.. I prefer trusting people @ indiablo more than people @ jsp

This post was edited by Ancalagon on Oct 6 2008 05:47am
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Oct 6 2008 05:49am
Quote (TheUndyingGod @ Mon, Oct 6 2008, 11:38am)
6 fpa is the fastest possible smite speed.

It was tested through a calculator.  I just cannot link you to it as it would be an external link  sad.gif


Quote (Ancalagon @ Mon, Oct 6 2008, 11:44am)
joost google "titanseal speedcalc english"


thanks for all of u
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Oct 6 2008 05:53am
Quote (Ancalagon @ Mon, 6 Oct 2008, 12:16)
damage to demons of loh is applied with smite because it is normal off weapon ed

if you don`t think it is applied, show me the source of that first.

why shoudl inferior work be stickied?

LoH provides +350 % Damage to Demons, a modifier that does not work with Smite

Smite FAQ (this is the updated version, newer than the one stickied in d2jsp)
http://www.battle.net/forums/thread.aspx?fn=d2-general&t=1310761&p=1&#post1310761

Quote (oramin@Battle.net Forums)
The following things do not work with Smite:

- Leech (life/mana)
- Deadly Strike/Critical Strike (confirmed by both Oramin and Vash-dm independently in 1.11)
- Knockback (apart from the standard Knockback on the skill)
- Elemental damage from equipment or charms
- Elemental damage from auras (e.g. Holy Shock) (the area effect will still work, just not the applied damage)
- Poison damage from charms or the Venom proc on "Treachery" (tested by Oramin in 1.12) or on "Grief" (tested by Greentea101 in 1.12)
- Magic damage from Sanctuary (note that I havent verified this for 1.10+ but I dont see any reason it should have changed; the area effect will still work, just not the applied damage) (added on behalf of gibbousmoon)
- Gear and charms that add a set amount of damage (verified by SSJPunk) except for those items which have the Damage +X attribute (e.g. WarTravs will *not* add damage to Smite except for the STR bonus)
- Enhanced Damage on the weapon
- Enhanced Damage to Demons (e.g. Laying of Hands) (Thanks to Bonkshasa, Posterboy, and Talamek for testing)
- Enhanced Damage to Undead (Thanks to Talamek for testing in 1.11)

I would be careful before challenging oramin's topic.

LoH should only be considered on an Uber smiter if you need additional IAS and fire res.

Undying's guide covers pertinent questions that most people are likely to have about skill distribution and gear suggestions. Obviously, one can always disagree about certain points and have different opinions.
But it does not license any of us to call his guide inferior. If anything, it would make us seem rather silly.

It is beyond my comprehension why you keep arguing about the amulet. We all know that Hlord and Mara are perfectly viable options. Why not be content with them ? Besides, hardly any of us would consider
a sick rare or crafted amulet when Hlord and Mara are way more affordable. This is a PvM Uber Smiter - not some wicked insane PvP character.

@Undying
Some items that I would have liked to see in the guide, offering people more gear options
  • Duress
  • Dracul's (setup #2)
  • HoZ (not everyone can afford Exile)
  • Treachery (prebuff, higher Fade than LW)
  • Gore Rider (both setups)
Couple Duress + Dracul's + Gore Rider with Grief + Guillaume's and you will be looking at the effect of constant high dmg and plenty of CB + OW.

Other suggestions
  • Encourage people to choose just ST or SR for the Exile, not Vortex and Zakarum (poor shield block, high str reqs, and same average dmg).
  • Option for safety vs Meph: Salvation with Grief (6 fpa Smite using PB but no Fana requires 65 % IAS [Grief + Hlord + IAS jewel in Guillaume's])
  • Using 2 x Raven instead of Raven + Dwarf would save you 15-20 dex (~ 45-60 life). Cold dmg is ridiculous against max cold res and 40 % absorb.
If anything else crosses my mind, I might shove in a few additional comments.

Other than that, your guide looks alright.

This post was edited by Faelwen on Oct 6 2008 05:58am
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Oct 6 2008 07:14am
Quote (Ancalagon @ Mon, 6 Oct 2008, 01:04)
cateye..

1st of all..
Why do you consider my post an insult?
because I say that theundyinggod did not do a great job and can do many things to improve his/her work?

if one cannot take criticism, one should not try to publish something.

by the way...
I have published work of me in this forum and I have given a lot of input to several guides here.
If you want to see, what I consider a real guide, check the stickies-->Paladin guides-->PvM Fanazealotguide by Ancalagon

or just click this link
<A target=_blank href="http://forums.d2jsp.org/index.php?showtopic=22041840&f=161&st=0">http://forums.d2jsp.org/index.php?showtopic=22041840&f=161&st=0</A>

I am really looking forward to your feedback.

Just do me one favor, I know that this sounds arrogant but....
do your homework beforre you try to confront me.


I know that even my guide is far from being complete.. I copuld include low level gear, weapons like honor,baezils,cranbeak and so on and so forth but if I take a look at pretty much all other JSP guides, there is none that is as detailed as my one.

I could even republish my Hammerdinguide, which was avialable at the AB for a while but hey.. 7500 words seems a bot too complex for the average JSP kiddy.

@ theundyinggod
1. efficiency does not need very expensive items, I can show you setups for tristram smiters, that cost less while doing more damage and also having full ress, lt,ow,maxspeed and so on and so forth.

2. As I have already stated, there are always different ways to do the job.
f.e. if one plays HC, one will not really want to invest much into a char that is not used very often but one will rather go for a setup which will be successful at a price that does not hurt the player in the case of death.

@ mana
how many purples or blue pots do you wanna spent on mana
how long do you wanna smite without fana?

let`s see
grief and astreons deal more damage than lw,
considering the fact, that one will probably rather use LoH if one does not use draculs, because of the 350 additional off weapon ed (another mistake in your guide) or the fact, that other weapons will need more ias, or the fact that one will probably use salvation versus mephisto and thus not be at maxspeed with a pb (65 ias without fana)
highlords is worth mentioning.
also I could mention, that I stated that one should use a highlord`s, if one still needs ias.

@ amulet choice
a. nothing is as easy as reaching fullress with a paladin
b. 1-10% higher blockchance,2 palaskills, up to :
20 prisma 40% single resistances, 20 dex,60 life,30 str,damred,liferep and so on and so forth.... and you really want to tell me that it takes a lot to outshine a maras?

by the way.....
what kind of answers do you expect from a community like JSP where 90% of the users seem to know as much about the game as a sawfish knows about plaining




then how do you presume to be able to critisise this guide, if you just admit that yours is not perfect.
instead of putting so much energy in proving this is not a good guide why dont you spend your energy to perfect yours.
if you could do that( which i dought) i think we will all be happy to have a good guide at our disposal.
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Oct 6 2008 07:20am
Quote (Faelwen @ Mon, 6 Oct 2008, 13:53)
.



now this is what i call an educated critisism.

you have my full respect

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Oct 6 2008 10:07am
Quote (Faelwen @ Mon, 6 Oct 2008, 07:53)
I would be careful before challenging oramin's topic.

LoH should only be considered on an Uber smiter if you need additional IAS and fire res.

Undying's guide covers pertinent questions that most people are likely to have about skill distribution and gear suggestions. Obviously, one can always disagree about certain points and have different opinions.
But it does not license any of us to call his guide inferior. If anything, it would make us seem rather silly.

It is beyond my comprehension why you keep arguing about the amulet. We all know that Hlord and Mara are perfectly viable options. Why not be content with them ? Besides, hardly any of us would consider
a sick rare or crafted amulet when Hlord and Mara are way more affordable. This is a PvM Uber Smiter - not some wicked insane PvP character.

@Undying
Some items that I would have liked to see in the guide, offering people more gear options

  • Duress
  • Dracul's (setup #2)
  • HoZ (not everyone can afford Exile)
  • Treachery (prebuff, higher Fade than LW)
  • Gore Rider (both setups)
Couple Duress + Dracul's + Gore Rider with Grief + Guillaume's and you will be looking at the effect of constant high dmg and plenty of CB + OW.

Other suggestions

  • Encourage people to choose just ST or SR for the Exile, not Vortex and Zakarum (poor shield block, high str reqs, and same average dmg).
  • Option for safety vs Meph: Salvation with Grief (6 fpa Smite using PB but no Fana requires 65 % IAS [Grief + Hlord + IAS jewel in Guillaume's])
  • Using 2 x Raven instead of Raven + Dwarf would save you 15-20 dex (~ 45-60 life). Cold dmg is ridiculous against max cold res and 40 % absorb.
If anything else crosses my mind, I might shove in a few additional comments.

Other than that, your guide looks alright.


I will never thank you enough.

Thanks for suggestions and for clearing this up aswell.
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