I fuckin wish any of this was true

God so do I

Took a lot of beating over the head just to get Joe to say he wants some kind of public option.

Black's doing exactly what I accused him of lol. He seems to think that by doing the exact same thing more it will substantiate his position on any one of them.

This post was edited by Thor123422 on Oct 23 2020 10:36pm

That the Democratic party moved sharply to the left on a ton of issues in recent years is a fact, no matter how many times you pretend otherwise.
And the argument I made about where we can reasonably expect the Democratic rhetoric on fracking to fall relative to their true intentions is a cogent one too.


You and mangix focus too narrowly on the old guard Democrats like Biden and Pelosi and how those are hesitant to sign on to the march toward lefty utopia that the rank and file of the party have embraced. It really isnt hard to see that the center of gravity of the party has moved leftward. And 47 years of experience with Biden always positioning himself near the middle of whereever his party was at any given moment clearly suggest that he will come along eventually, particularly if the election is a landslide and they can point to some sort of "mandate" for their agenda.

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Oct 23 2020 10:45pm

What you're missing is that the left groups you're referencing have virtually no power in the Democrat party, and Biden is part of the group that is intent to keep it that way.

He is trying to please the left by throwing them a bone.

If you've only been paying attention to politics for 4 years I see why you might have this opinion, but the last time we had a Democrat landslide they passed Republican-Healthcare-lite, and now we're electing the vice president of that administration.

You're speaking in conspiracy. There are maybe 10 actually progressive people in the current congress. The rest are fairly vanilla liberals asking for super basic shit that is being viewed as radical. You need to look inward on this topic dude. The world is progressing faster than it used to and our country is being left behind massively, yet you're viewing that result as radical. This is why we're losing in every metric across the world.

Again: Biden has been anunideological opportunist for all of his political career, he will go wherever his party goes. Back in 2008, the party wasn't nearly as woke as it is today, "socialism" wasn't nearly as fashionable, going ham on spending (MMT, GND) was not even a fringe position within the party, and so on and forth.

The fact that insurgents like AOC dont have a lot of power yet doesnt discount the clear trends. Bernie and his camp were allowed to make a lot of input to the Biden platform, you had the primary debates full of calls for wealth taxes, socialized healthcare, open borders, sweeping fossil bans and so on.

This post was edited by Black XistenZ on Oct 23 2020 11:05pm

Yeahhhhh, you just sound like somebody that hasn't seen how the Democrat party operates.

They've been afraid to say they're Americans since the 80s.

And you sound like a typical Bernie bro - my way or the highway, revolution or bust, anything short of full blown socialism doesnt represent meaningful movement toward the left.

I mean, we haven't had any meaningful movement to the left.

Seriously, what have we gotten passed?

All that's been accomplished is getting Joe to pay lip service to the left, and it took beating him over the head for months to get him to say he wants to even improve our healthcare plans despite it having overwhelming support. It took months to get him to even make a statement on the minimum wage and he avoids talking about it at all cost.

This post was edited by Thor123422 on Oct 23 2020 11:54pm