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Jun 18 2019 02:51pm
https://nos.nl/artikel/2289609-tu-eindhoven-neemt-alleen-vrouwen-aan-goed-idee-je-moet-even-doorschieten.html

Excuses for the Dutch source, if you want you can put it through translate.

The tl;dr is that my old University, the Technological University of Eindhoven, will for the upcoming 18 months, only consider female applications for permanent positions. The exception is if the position has been open for half a year. Knowing my old department, my dean is just going to say he's been searching for half a year already when he has a suitable male applicant.

The arguments posed in favour are that especially the Technological Universities (we have 3, Eindhoven, Delft and Twente), have a very male focused network and atmosphere, which discourages women from wanting to apply. IE the only way to break that tendency is with positive discrimination. On the other hand, many people have posed that the women who get a job within those 18 months might be taken less seriously because people might think they only got in on the basis of their gender.

Now I do know that the sentiment towards women is not that great with many men at the uni. Jokes about women are rampant, which isn't that much of an issue, but I've known both professors and students who've made incredibly nasty remarks towards the female students and staff. In how much that is unique for the environment I couldn't say.

Personally, I do agree that more female representation in tech would be a good thing. It's really fucking embarassing how bad many staff and students are in social skills in general, but especially interacting with women. There's a lot of ground to gain there. I don't think this is the right approach though. I'd rather see the current efforts of recruiting female STEM students/staff increase, our current numbers are absolutely dreadful compared to the rest of the world. Positive reinforcement >> positive discrimination imo.

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Jun 18 2019 02:56pm
I dont mind programs trying to get young women into STEM. it's not equal, but i get it. there's a "problem" with representation, and that address it.

but any sort of quota is just a bad idea. it's just treating the symptom while simultaneously causing animosity in the workplace towards women from people who think they didn't earn their spot.
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Jun 18 2019 02:58pm
Is this like the harvard of holland
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Jun 18 2019 02:59pm
Quote (excellence @ Jun 18 2019 08:58pm)
Is this like the harvard of holland


Not really. More like the Caltech or MIT, whichever one has more connections with industry.

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Jun 18 2019 03:08pm
Quote (balrog66 @ 18 Jun 2019 22:51)
https://nos.nl/artikel/2289609-tu-eindhoven-neemt-alleen-vrouwen-aan-goed-idee-je-moet-even-doorschieten.html

Excuses for the Dutch source, if you want you can put it through translate.

The tl;dr is that my old University, the Technological University of Eindhoven, will for the upcoming 18 months, only consider female applications for permanent positions. The exception is if the position has been open for half a year. Knowing my old department, my dean is just going to say he's been searching for half a year already when he has a suitable male applicant.

The arguments posed in favour are that especially the Technological Universities (we have 3, Eindhoven, Delft and Twente), have a very male focused network and atmosphere, which discourages women from wanting to apply. IE the only way to break that tendency is with positive discrimination. On the other hand, many people have posed that the women who get a job within those 18 months might be taken less seriously because people might think they only got in on the basis of their gender.

Now I do know that the sentiment towards women is not that great with many men at the uni. Jokes about women are rampant, which isn't that much of an issue, but I've known both professors and students who've made incredibly nasty remarks towards the female students and staff. In how much that is unique for the environment I couldn't say.

Personally, I do agree that more female representation in tech would be a good thing. It's really fucking embarassing how bad many staff and students are in social skills in general, but especially interacting with women. There's a lot of ground to gain there. I don't think this is the right approach though. I'd rather see the current efforts of recruiting female STEM students/staff increase, our current numbers are absolutely dreadful compared to the rest of the world. Positive reinforcement >> positive discrimination imo.

https://assets.weforum.org/editor/ZXFf3jzUcY7mErlDFS8euvPQiTxc1nYFMufPDO2kW3E.png


I agree that quotas and "positive" discrimination are not a good approach to solve the lack of female representation in tech. Btw: what's shown on the y-axis of your chart?
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Jun 18 2019 03:10pm
Quote (balrog66 @ 18 Jun 2019 16:59)
Not really. More like the Caltech or MIT, whichever one has more connections with industry.



ah just figured it was given the blatant discriminatory practices

that said it makes sense given the idea of their place their rules - just gives me more reason to laugh at their absurd method of “problem-solving”
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Jun 18 2019 03:13pm
Quote (Black XistenZ @ Jun 18 2019 09:08pm)
I agree that quotas and "positive" discrimination are not a good approach to solve the lack of female representation in tech. Btw: what's shown on the y-axis of your chart?


It's gender equality in general. So the graph shows a 'paradox', where as gender equality in a society rises, female participation in STEM is lower.
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Jun 18 2019 03:14pm
Nvm someone asked already

This post was edited by Neptunus on Jun 18 2019 03:14pm
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Jun 18 2019 03:14pm
this kind of open discrimination cant possibly be legal, completely fucked up
where are the european courts when you really need them?

there is no such thing as positive discrimination, all discrimination is bad by definition

"On the other hand, many people have posed that the women who get a job within those 18 months might be taken less seriously because people might think they only got in on the basis of their gender."

exactly, these guys are literally about to ruin the poor women who will get these jobs and that wont go away
i cant how much other people care about that, but it would scare me away tbh

aside from that, according to the same people who had this glorious idea gender doesnt matter right?
nobody should care about gender distribution, science is about skill
more men than women want to pursue a career in tech, thats a fact

if they tried something like that at my physics faculty there literally would have been no people anymore
on the other hand, while chemistry at my uni is more or less even between the genders, the food/bio chemsitry programs are like 90% women and nobody ever complained about that
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Jun 18 2019 03:17pm
Quote (ampoo @ Jun 18 2019 04:14pm)
this kind of open discrimination cant possibly be legal, completely fucked up
where are the european courts when you really need them?

there is no such thing as positive discrimination, all discrimination is bad by definition

"On the other hand, many people have posed that the women who get a job within those 18 months might be taken less seriously because people might think they only got in on the basis of their gender."

exactly, these guys are literally about to ruin the poor women who will get these jobs and that wont go away
i cant how much other people care about that, but it would scare me away tbh

aside from that, according to the same people who had this glorious idea gender doesnt matter right?
nobody should care about gender distribution, science is about skill
more men than women want to pursue a career in tech, thats a fact

if they tried something like that at my physics faculty there literally would have been no people anymore
on the other hand, while chemistry at my uni is more or less even between the genders, the food/bio chemsitry programs are like 90% women and nobody ever complained about that


Been going on since witch hunting bro.
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