169.5
vs
191

These are average damages. Difference of 21.5. Post pvp-3.58 damage. post pvp+50dr=1.79 damage.
For less than 4 avg damage, you get a 6% chance to double damage (deadly stike calculated after crit, used 70 crit for this calc). Now, let's think about how many arrows are shot/hit an enemy in a duel. I'm going to go with about 15 hits before someone is dead. I know it varies, but let's just use that number. With faith, 70% of your hits do double damage, resulting in about 7 more average damage than foi on a crit. That means 10-11 hits a duel crit with faith. With foi, 11-12 arrows will double damage. This is the part where your inv/build comes into play. What's on screen damage? Let's say it's 288-6606 (from this guide: http://forums.d2jsp.org/topic.php?t=3150588). Average damage of 3447. Post pvp, 574.5 damage per arrow. Now, with 10-11 arrows criting, that means in 15 arrows, you're doing 2872.5 damage form normal strikes, and 11490 with crits.* 14362.5 damage right there. NOW, let's adjust for Foi. Now, let's just say you have about 800 ed from gear/dex. post pvp that means you'll be losing around 5.25 damage. I got that by taking avg damage, dividing by 9 (how many times your damage is multiplied), subtracting 3.6 (avg damage difference between the bows), and multiplying by 9 again for ed. Since avg damage from inv/war travs doesn't change pre/post ed, there's no need to do anything with that. So now you have a 569.25 ga, and 11-12 will crit. This means you do 2277 non-crit damage, and 12523.5 damage that's doubled. 14800.5. 438 damage difference in 15 arrows. 219 if opponent is 59 dr. I can't tell you how many times I've killed a zon and had less than 219 life.

Quickly, the calculation is actually 10.5 arrows out of 15 with 70 crit and faith, 11.4 with 70 crit and foi. so 9 out of 10 times, you'll do more damage with foi, and 1/10 times you'll do 136.5 more damage with faith.

A note about war travs: it also has stats. Good, useful stats.

In the end, calculate everything on your zon, with your build. Basically, glass zons are going to love the ds from foi, tanky ones will like the higher avg damage of faith.

Though foi has ias, which gives a LOT more flexibility in gear, especially for a tank. Didn't want to use cat's and get a nice rare instead? That's fine. Want to use a rare circ on your tank with dungos? Now you can!

In my opinion, foi is better in every case.

I just did a shit ton of calculations for viper, and determined that atma's+foi gives more damage on average than faith gmb+highlord's. Each build is different though, this is not an absolute.

The majority of people on d2jsp are just like the majority of people in America, pertaining to politics
They like to pack form on an opinion but really know very little about what is really going on and would never take the time to actually learn ~ it's too much effort






The above is wrong

FOI only adds +20 IAS
You will be able to use either:
* A Rare Circlet over the 45/120, or
* A Dungo over the Nosferatu
But you won't be able to use both

Grand Matron Bow requires 92% IAS to hit 7fpa



A build with FOI will look like this, if you go Rare Circlet:
* FOI (20% IAS)
* Rare Circlet (30% IAS)
* Fort
* Nosferatu (10% IAS) <-- You'll still need this, don't let that 20% IAS on FOI fool you
* (20% IAS) Gloves
* War Traveler
* Cat's Eye (20% IAS)


A build with FOI will look like this, if you go Dungo: <-- This setup is the better bet because DR% is something that you can't get off SCs, the res off the Rare Diadem can be made up for with 5% SCs
* FOI (20% IAS)
* (45% IAS)/120
* Fort
* Dungo
* (20% IAS) Gloves
* War Traveler
* Cat's Eye (20% IAS)




On Europe, due to Bugged Belt, FOI is a relevant option
But on East/West ~ If you're going to use FOI, you may as well be using a Diamond, the benefits will be greater

Yep my bad meant to say rare or dungo. But point is foi is worth it. It can supply on average 100 more damage per arrow if built correctly.

Build discussion concerning foi vs faith is:

helm: 45ias
Foi: 20ias
gloves: 20ias
BB: 10ias
Eth Rare matris: 40ias

switch

Faith+hl: 20ias

I see what you're saying but you really shouldn't be wearing anything other than Cat's Eye or Highlord's in PvP (Highlord's even, should only be used as a swap vs. V/Ts with FoH or similar builds that pressure your light res)
Atmas just does not work well in the end, 5% proc for a base level 1 amp is not only an unreliable proc but it's duration is too short to be practical
Losing the 30% FRW from Cat's Eye is a bad idea
Remember that 30% FRW on an amulet is more +20 life SCs that you will be carrying in your INV
Concerning 3% FRW SCs, that 30% FRW is worth 200 health, before BO
Concerning 5% FRW SCs, it's still 120 health, before BO

The choice of 45/120 to compensate for the lack of Cat's/Highlord's is also a bad idea
A Rare Diadem with ideal stats can front +30 STR and +20 DEX and since every extra point added to vitality on an Amazon adds +3 health, those + stats are worth a direct 150 health, before BO
By ditching Cat's/Highlord's you are losing around 350 health value, which is a big loss (considering that a good vitazon hits at only 2000 health before BO)

It takes an Amazon about 2000 health to be able to survive a single hammer or a single Blizzard, ect.. ect..
Often an Amazon survives a single hit and then gets a handful of dodges/avoids before a next hit lands and actually kills it
By sacrificing that big dip of 350 non BO'd health, you're going to end up with an Amazon that dies in 1 hit to Hammers/Blizzards/Charges
and 2 hits, to things like a Barb's/Ghost's whirlwind or a powerful smiter

The DPS (damage per second) that you are trying to achieve with Atma's 5% chance to proc 6 second duration, is not worth the loss in health and/or FRW
That 5% proc is only working 5/100 arrows that actually land a real hit
Those chances are terrible and in most rounds or even a full ft5, that proc won't even go off once

worth it vs druid imo
wolves and oak can't block arrows so they get hit everytime -> high chances of amp

Yup, amp is worth it vs Druid
But that's what 33% proc on a Lacerator is for
And you even get to keep the 30% FRW off the Cat's Eye

Atma's is just outdated in modern ZvA setups
There are better ways to proc Amplify Damage

This post was edited by TSBoyer on May 29 2013 08:48am

Trouble is, if it's a stream of arrows, one amp proc means about 2-3 arrows with amp damage, which means 1-2 crit and get quadruple damage. Imo that burst dps is totally worth it.

sry to say your totally clueless first off cats is a BIG NN since it's bugged frw which means it just ruins your frw sync (same thing goes for 30frw on circlet/diadem and seing as I use 3/100life I get a nice life boost from that while maintaining high damage+ias - but as mentioned earlier here in the thread that's a topic for another discussion) so your left with 2 choices hl or atmas or well in theory a rare amu but imo nn u wanna be able to do switch to hl in certain situations like when using eth tits or stacking lr etc.

My ama already have like 135+ frw on bow slot from 5frw 3max 20ar sc's + 5frw 5@ sc's + wt's/bitters/upg infernos and some even use as much as 175-200 frw which in my opinion is totally pointless but that's a matter of taste/playing style - I like to have overall nice life and decent damage and tank a lot with eth rare matris since bolt adds nice light damage + kb and many people tend to only use dr vs a bower/hybrid/tribrid

in my experience amp actually does proc quite often and especially vs. hdins with oak, necs with oak+golem and druids that have the entire zoo - for instance by using straffe which quite often will instantaneously trigger amp but it does also trigger very well with fury/bolt/ga/multi and as I said before the 20% ar helps a lot vs mb users when using multi but also fury/bolt (ar is hidden attribute - doesn't show on screen). As a huge bonus with foi is the 7%ll vs the above mentioned chars.

and ofc I statted my passives to match atmas in bow and javelin mode so that's not a problem either and also without hl I don't have the issue with crit+ds battling for proc

I have both switches faith+hl and foi+atmas and I change them up once in a while but haven't really noticed a huge difference tbh

and lacerator switch is only really viable for pure bowers and imo eth tits or rare javs with mb is by far the better choice over lacerator amp proc switching

This post was edited by ViperClaw on May 29 2013 10:13am