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Sep 14 2017 10:53am
Quote (Gastly @ Sep 14 2017 08:38am)
I seem to have missed where Marx talks about cults of personality, ethnic purging and gulags.


Read Marx again. Read the parts about how religion is the opiate of the people and such. Read his perspective on private property and such. I know you think these ideas are in a vacuum and he's innocent but he's not. There's a reason why so many of his readers whether in South America or Russia or wherever else always came to similar conclusions. Marxism is theory, the various forms of communism are merely theory meeting real life application.



Quote (UberCMAK @ Sep 14 2017 09:26am)
Many "victims" claim to be innocent, while in reality they were criminals


Wtf does this even mean? I know my grandmother and other victims that were literally shipped to Siberia because either they were Christians, or they were considered bourgeoisie this isn't fable this is fact. Being a Christian and owning a little land when the communists came rolling through was not a good time.

This post was edited by ofthevoid on Sep 14 2017 10:57am
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Sep 14 2017 11:59am
Quote (ofthevoid @ Sep 14 2017 09:29am)
Actually it has very much to do with. After the soviets came my grandmother and her family was shipped off to Siberia precisely because of communist ideals.

They had private property and were relatively well off. Instead they ended up in some Tundra simply because they were Christian and had a little land and stuff.


Because of Soviet ideals*
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Sep 14 2017 04:41pm
Quote (Voyaging @ Sep 14 2017 10:59am)
Because of Soviet ideals*



Nope communism is a better fit. Her father owned land and had a store.

Look at every communist country to ever exist. When the "revolution" happens, owners of fill in the blank are not regarded too kindly. This has been the recipe on many different continents.
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Sep 14 2017 04:45pm
Quote (ofthevoid @ Sep 14 2017 05:41pm)
Nope communism is a better fit. Her father owned land and had a store.

Look at every communist country to ever exist. When the "revolution" happens, owners of fill in the blank are not regarded too kindly. This has been the recipe on many different continents.


Where they happened generally people were experiencing starvation on a wide scale already. True for Russia anyway. China was in awful shape due to the Robin Hood in reverse thing going on. The Reign of Terror was the same way.

These revolutions wouldnt even be possible unless things were unbelievably bad. Theae were normal people who did this, so ask yourself, how bad would things have to be before you started slitting throats? Are you willing to watch your children starve to preserve the symbolic order?

This post was edited by Skinned on Sep 14 2017 04:46pm
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Sep 14 2017 04:45pm
Quote (Scaly @ Sep 14 2017 04:14am)
I'm gonna guess you don't do History at an English University.
Most academics, especially in humanities, are relatively left-wing socially but there are thousands of books on the gulags and the USSR at least. We have several modules dedicated to the Soviets. None of them shy away from the horrors suffered under the regime. Nazis are just more popular. Perhaps one reason for that is that the 2nd World War affected us directly. Many of us are only one generation from someone who fought in it, but few of us have relatives that lived in a gulag.
Not even the most left-wing professor at my University would claim that the USSR was an ideal system though.


i'm sure they would praise trotskyism
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Sep 14 2017 04:48pm
Quote (majorblood @ Sep 14 2017 05:45pm)
i'm sure they would praise trotskyism


Most wouldnt know the difference or know who Trotsky is unless they were history professors... You guys have pretty strong opinions of academia...you should just go experience it. It isnt full of liberal boogymen lol.

This post was edited by Skinned on Sep 14 2017 04:48pm
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Sep 14 2017 04:51pm
Quote (Skinned @ Sep 14 2017 02:48pm)
Most wouldnt know the difference or know who Trotsky is unless they were history professors... You guys have pretty strong opinions of academia...you should just go experience it. It isnt full of liberal boogymen lol.


I had to take some liberal electives early on while studying physics, decided to take history and learned all about trotskyism.
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Sep 14 2017 04:53pm
Quote (Skinned @ 14 Sep 2017 18:48)
Most wouldnt know the difference or know who Trotsky is unless they were history professors... You guys have pretty strong opinions of academia...you should just go experience it. It isnt full of liberal boogymen lol.

>anyone i disagree with on the internet has never "experienced academia"
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Sep 14 2017 04:55pm
Quote (Skinned @ Sep 14 2017 03:45pm)
Where they happened generally people were experiencing starvation on a wide scale already. True for Russia anyway. China was in awful shape due to the Robin Hood in reverse thing going on.

These revolutions wouldnt even be possible unless things were unbelievably bad. Theae were normal people who did this, so ask yourself, how bad would things have to be before you started slitting throats? Are you willing to watch your children starve to preserve the symbolic order?



I get your point, but you pretend that this was just a few angry peasants getting together and doing something about the world not being fair. When her family got shipped off in 47,communism was a force to be reckoned with not some plebs with pitch forks. They didn't uproot both of my great grand fathers families, place them on trains and send them to Siberia because a mob decided it. This was systemic, well thought out & purposeful.

They were being uprooted because it's easier to ship these people off so the govt can take all their shit when gone instead of leaving them there to protest.

This post was edited by ofthevoid on Sep 14 2017 04:57pm
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Sep 14 2017 04:56pm
Quote (ofthevoid @ Sep 14 2017 02:55pm)
I get your point, but you pretend that this was just a few angry peasants getting together and doing something about the world not being fair. When her family got shipped off in 47,communism was a force to be reckoned with not some plebs with pitch forks. They didn't uproot both of my great grand fathers families, place them on trains and send them to Siberia because a mob decided it. This was systemic, well thought out & purposeful.


almost as bad as the systemic racism occurring in the usa
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