d2jsp
Log InRegister
d2jsp Forums > d2jsp > Ladder Slasher > Overview And Discussion On Updateable Topics > Plz Read The Discription Before You Post
Prev12345Next
Add Reply New Topic New Poll
Member
Posts: 70,346
Joined: Nov 2 2007
Gold: 131,630.78
Trader: Trusted
May 15 2015 02:06pm
Quote (sir_lance_bb @ 15 May 2015 20:53)
A return to previous NMNM or Ambush would just result in people doing those quests multiple times a climb. Which people did and were rewarded for it.

The quests of Ambush/NMNM need to be able to be spawned reliably in a group and No Maze No More needs to have Elemental Education removed as a prereq, otherwise you have to go through a big hassle to spawn it. As in a hardcore league, I'm not trusting anyone on EE with casters in my game with EE and even if you don't have casters, EE is a pretty hard quest that requires a pretty solid group composition and some gear.

Make quests spawn easier to where if you explore early, you can expect to hit them. Change NMNM to not require EE to be done. And then make it to where quests only pop up once a climb and heavily increase the reward for doing them and potentially increase their difficulty to meet the reward. And the fact they can only appear once a climb prevents people from farming them over and over.

Also high level farming should also be rewarded. Anyone who completes evils over level 100 , the drop rate should be greatly increased. The amount of risk and effort here warrants it.


sounds all logical and reasonable to me.

thx for the post! i like it :thumbsup:
Member
Posts: 18,455
Joined: Jan 5 2007
Gold: 325.73
May 16 2015 12:45pm
Urgent need: Paul please read this thread


I am sure this is the best from all suggestions.
Member
Posts: 38,097
Joined: Apr 29 2006
Gold: 8,666.98
May 16 2015 03:56pm
Quote (sir_lance_bb @ May 16 2015 08:53am)
A return to previous NMNM or Ambush would just result in people doing those quests multiple times a climb. Which people did and were rewarded for it.

The quests of Ambush/NMNM need to be able to be spawned reliably in a group and No Maze No More needs to have Elemental Education removed as a prereq, otherwise you have to go through a big hassle to spawn it. As in a hardcore league, I'm not trusting anyone on EE with casters in my game with EE and even if you don't have casters, EE is a pretty hard quest that requires a pretty solid group composition and some gear.

Make quests spawn easier to where if you explore early, you can expect to hit them. Change NMNM to not require EE to be done. And then make it to where quests only pop up once a climb and heavily increase the reward for doing them and potentially increase their difficulty to meet the reward. And the fact they can only appear once a climb prevents people from farming them over and over.

Also high level farming should also be rewarded. Anyone who completes evils over level 100 , the drop rate should be greatly increased. The amount of risk and effort here warrants it.


NMNM + EE: This is a decent idea to remove EE as a requirement, how would lowering the level req of EE so that it can spawn earlier? [thus keeping it a req for NMNM]

Quest only pop up once: This is a good idea, I can see it being abused... "oh look, shamans, nevermind, we just remake since only 3 of us in group", "oh look, four corners, they take too long, let us remake" and so on.

High level farming: yes, there should be a better reward from them, but we also know that only a few people can do this, so instead of gaining GPs for reaching level 101, how about giving you a "Do over if you Fail", as it reads, let us say you are a monk, you make it to level 101 and fail MQ, instead of resetting you straight away, you get to re-try... OR... if you fail a key, it lets you re-pick the key for that door.
__________________________

The game needs real balance.

People don't want "Durability" to be introduced because they will lose fg if introducing a repair shop in the MP, so we introduce Skills for people to learn to reduce that cost, and, if the skills were introduced, you can provide a market by selling your trade of repair, which brings in a bit more economy to the game. NOTE: the bad side is, it will take ages for someone to get good at repairing level 55 items.

1-71 Speed climbs... to me this needs to slow down by making monsters 300% harder at the start [lvl1] and tether out the higher you get. As for rewards, we already get tons of low level items to compensate for it.

Objective Rewards: increase these rewards to make it seem worthwhile to complete them.
... Maze = 1-5 extra slots
... Pinch = 1-5 extra stats
... Bits = 1-5 extra dexterity
... Hack = 100-300 max life
... Face = 2-8 extra stats
... Shamans = 100-300 max mana
... Treasure = 1-5 extra stats + 1-5 extra slots
... Sneaky = 2-10 extra vitality [or add something like +100-300 max life]
... Ambush = 2-8 extra dexterity
... Slash = 200-500 max life
... Four Cnrs = 1-2 Ability Points [or add something like +100-300 max mana]
... E E = 2-8 extra intelligence
... NMNM = 2-8 extra Strength
... Mirror = 7-15 guild points [or add "re-do 1 failed key when doing MQ"]

Note: above rewards seem high, but in reality it does not make much difference at all, but, they do look more appealing.

Find another balance for Life Steal, maybe it works normally when facing the same monsters to the Tier of the weapon, as the
monster levels increase, or reach another tier, the Life Steal diminishes in effect, best examples would be going from level 55-101,
by the time they reach 90, life steal would only steal 1 life per attack [or something like that]

Introduce "Specialised Skills" for each Class, they can only be activated at critical times: i.e when you are at 50% health or below.
Fighter = Barrage [1-9 attacks that round recieving 1-2 lpa per number of targets. Only activated when at 50% or lower health]
Mage = Channelling [Draws mana from one monster to replenish mana similar to 1-3 mpa. Only activated when at 33% or lower mana]
Guardian = Blessed Aid [Party is fully healed. Only activated when PARTY has 50% or less life]
etc [personally could not think of any others, maybe you people can come up with ideas]
Member
Posts: 37,611
Joined: May 3 2007
Gold: 119,903.34
May 16 2015 04:08pm
Quote (izParagonzi @ May 16 2015 05:56pm)
NMNM + EE: This is a decent idea to remove EE as a requirement, how would lowering the level req of EE so that it can spawn earlier? [thus keeping it a req for NMNM]

Quest only pop up once: This is a good idea, I can see it being abused... "oh look, shamans, nevermind, we just remake since only 3 of us in group", "oh look, four corners, they take too long, let us remake" and so on.

High level farming: yes, there should be a better reward from them, but we also know that only a few people can do this, so instead of gaining GPs for reaching level 101, how about giving you a "Do over if you Fail", as it reads, let us say you are a monk, you make it to level 101 and fail MQ, instead of resetting you straight away, you get to re-try... OR... if you fail a key, it lets you re-pick the key for that door.
__________________________

The game needs real balance.

People don't want "Durability" to be introduced because they will lose fg if introducing a repair shop in the MP, so we introduce Skills for people to learn to reduce that cost, and, if the skills were introduced, you can provide a market by selling your trade of repair, which brings in a bit more economy to the game. NOTE: the bad side is, it will take ages for someone to get good at repairing level 55 items.

1-71 Speed climbs... to me this needs to slow down by making monsters 300% harder at the start [lvl1] and tether out the higher you get. As for rewards, we already get tons of low level items to compensate for it.

Objective Rewards: increase these rewards to make it seem worthwhile to complete them.
... Maze = 1-5 extra slots
... Pinch = 1-5 extra stats
... Bits = 1-5 extra dexterity
... Hack = 100-300 max life
... Face = 2-8 extra stats
... Shamans = 100-300 max mana
... Treasure = 1-5 extra stats + 1-5 extra slots
... Sneaky = 2-10 extra vitality [or add something like +100-300 max life]
... Ambush = 2-8 extra dexterity
... Slash = 200-500 max life
... Four Cnrs = 1-2 Ability Points [or add something like +100-300 max mana]
... E E = 2-8 extra intelligence
... NMNM = 2-8 extra Strength
... Mirror = 7-15 guild points [or add "re-do 1 failed key when doing MQ"]

Note: above rewards seem high, but in reality it does not make much difference at all, but, they do look more appealing.

Find another balance for Life Steal, maybe it works normally when facing the same monsters to the Tier of the weapon, as the
monster levels increase, or reach another tier, the Life Steal diminishes in effect, best examples would be going from level 55-101,
by the time they reach 90, life steal would only steal 1 life per attack [or something like that]

Introduce "Specialised Skills" for each Class, they can only be activated at critical times: i.e when you are at 50% health or below.
Fighter = Barrage [1-9 attacks that round recieving 1-2 lpa per number of targets. Only activated when at 50% or lower health]
Mage = Channelling [Draws mana from one monster to replenish mana similar to 1-3 mpa. Only activated when at 33% or lower mana]
Guardian = Blessed Aid [Party is fully healed. Only activated when PARTY has 50% or less life]
etc [personally could not think of any others, maybe you people can come up with ideas]


EE is the 2nd hardest quest in the game to do. Even if you don't have casters in your game. They have crazy amounts of life and hit hard. No Maze No More just needs to not be gated by EE. It doesn't blend well for the game.

Also there's a lot of things people don't even realize regarding quests but that's an entire can of worms I'm not going to talk about.

The current speed of climbs is something I don't see going away. Because if the game difficulty is increased and the reward isn't there to match it, it's going to just be another problem.

Introducing content that makes quests harder and more rewarding would give those who just want to be rewarded playing an option. And if you want to do fast climbs, you can. And high level farming should be more rewarding than it is.

But the #1 thing that would make this game better is shortening of the seasons. The biggest problem is people play the game and then they get stuck and just stop playing once people hit alchemist/hh and then they'll play a little bit again when reset comes. So if reset was 3-6 months instead of year+ and in HC's case, 3 years each. There would be more activity if reset happened every 3-6 months. So then the downtime wouldn't be that big and people would play on the reset cause that environment is just naturally fun.
Member
Posts: 38,097
Joined: Apr 29 2006
Gold: 8,666.98
May 16 2015 05:40pm
Quote (sir_lance_bb @ May 17 2015 11:08am)
EE is the 2nd hardest quest in the game to do. Even if you don't have casters in your game. They have crazy amounts of life and hit hard. No Maze No More just needs to not be gated by EE. It doesn't blend well for the game.

Also there's a lot of things people don't even realize regarding quests but that's an entire can of worms I'm not going to talk about.

The current speed of climbs is something I don't see going away. Because if the game difficulty is increased and the reward isn't there to match it, it's going to just be another problem.

Introducing content that makes quests harder and more rewarding would give those who just want to be rewarded playing an option. And if you want to do fast climbs, you can. And high level farming should be more rewarding than it is.

But the #1 thing that would make this game better is shortening of the seasons. The biggest problem is people play the game and then they get stuck and just stop playing once people hit alchemist/hh and then they'll play a little bit again when reset comes. So if reset was 3-6 months instead of year+ and in HC's case, 3 years each. There would be more activity if reset happened every 3-6 months. So then the downtime wouldn't be that big and people would play on the reset cause that environment is just naturally fun.


Elemental Education.
1... keep the crap rewards and drop quality, remove EE as a requirement for NMNM and increase spawn rate of both objectives to complete them faster, thus meaning more chances to do MM and gain GPs.
2... keep it as it is, increase drop quality and rewards from those objectives, thus increasing the appeal to farm and clear other objectives.
3... nerf EE altogether and keep it as the NMNM requirement resulting in more chances to do MM and gain GPs.

Speed Climbs.
The only reason why they are fast is because there is no balance starting a climb to ending the climb. The fastest level gain is from level 1 to what? 55? and then it gets slower because of the difficulty of the monster and their life? On top of that, there are way more low to mid level items that drop in comparison to the higher end gear... thus the drop reward is there for those levels, Paul just needs to re-produce this for higher end gear, thus less complaints about it being slower, well, there weren't any complaints when it took 3+ days to MQ.

One thing is for certain, since the introduction of whistling, the seasons are effectively shorter than previously, only difference is that there are less players. I personally don't care about how long it takes to reset, it just means that the character has more time to build on skills when they can not pass to next class. Headhunter is a great class, build more on Axe / B-axe / wild or lightning skills, of course it would be more likely the axe overall.

High level farming, yes it should be more rewarding, and this is where he could diminish the drop criteria of tier I / IIs / IIIs altogether when at level 75 upwards, thus giving more chances of better shrineables to increase the speed of levelling and the chance to find an upgrade or higher level item that is useful.
Member
Posts: 70,346
Joined: Nov 2 2007
Gold: 131,630.78
Trader: Trusted
May 17 2015 01:06am
like lance said.. there is something like the "alchemist-burnout".. people playing alchemist lose the motivation to play..
i think the class alchemist is simply too weak.. i have no idea why the last class should be a lot weaker than warlock..
Strength 10 Dexterity 40 Intelligence 110 Vitality 15 the least thing you could do is take 35 of the dex to put into vitality and 5 of the str to put into int.. so alche starts with 115int and 50vita (or take all the 40 stats and put them into int...something around those lines)
alche cant even use a weapon but still got 40dex.. dex isnt affecting crits anymore (so i undertand this as a relict of older ls versions)

about rex:
i like your idea of the improved rewards.. atm it totally doesnt feel as if you really need the rewards.. they are really low (besides the MM reward ofc ^^)

ee isnt really the reason that MM is hard to do since you dont have to do it to open MM

also i dont see another time killing skill introduced.. i think forcing the people to do this wont work as many have spent enough time for muting or what not..
i dont know why you couldnt just farm while playing.. thats how it happens in other games too.

This post was edited by ahs_darkhunter on May 17 2015 01:35am
Member
Posts: 70,346
Joined: Nov 2 2007
Gold: 131,630.78
Trader: Trusted
Jun 6 2015 09:08am
Note to Paul: If you like an idea in the topic and think the information is too general, just post here and we all can think about it more in detail.

Urgent changes
-balance changes of the magical stats like healmastery (change it like it was before?), jubilance, damage return, mana skin, eventually the element masteries, eventually life steal, life per hit and life per kill
- improvement of the economy: suggestions: sellable wellables? maybe stackable wellables to improve this?
- revive a "farming ability" meaning more regularspawn of ambush or higher questslike nomazenomore or face the evil + balance changes(further explanation on post #4; 14))
-improvement of the drop rate: new balance between "short after the last update" and "now"; also rebalancing drops on maps (post #13) (we allrdy see a good improvement of the drop quantity!)
-improvement of the market: maybe 2-3 items that could sell forhigher than 20 fg without fee upfront (still no spam, but more items on the mp)
- complete overhaul of a big part of the abilities ("crossover abilities", other useless abilities)
- overworked class related experience (further explanation in post #4)[/B]

This post was edited by ahs_darkhunter on Jun 6 2015 09:09am
Member
Posts: 30,429
Joined: Dec 28 2010
Gold: 134.69
Jun 6 2015 11:21am
a challenge, a reason to get better gear. yes it makes for a faster 1-71, but if there were a boss fight at 80 or a challenging encounter of any kind people would flock back. nobody wants to click click click (and you dont even have to do that) anymore. give us a reason to bring a tank and a healer, not just 5 dps. all i'm saying is i started this game on hardcore and have never died, that should never happen in any game.
Member
Posts: 70,346
Joined: Nov 2 2007
Gold: 131,630.78
Trader: Trusted
Jun 6 2015 11:27am
Quote (dude_927 @ 6 Jun 2015 18:21)
a challenge, a reason to get better gear. yes it makes for a faster 1-71, but if there were a boss fight at 80 or a challenging encounter of any kind people would flock back. nobody wants to click click click (and you dont even have to do that) anymore. give us a reason to bring a tank and a healer, not just 5 dps. all i'm saying is i started this game on hardcore and have never died, that should never happen in any game.


i would love a higher lvl boss fight or something.. actually something rewarding.. (up to lvl 101.. or even more rewarding on higher lvls.. i would grind up all way ^^)
should get discussed.. i guess there are many ideas out there.. it just needs to be realized in some way.
Member
Posts: 30,429
Joined: Dec 28 2010
Gold: 134.69
Jun 6 2015 12:51pm
Quote (ahs_darkhunter @ Jun 6 2015 12:27pm)
i would love a higher lvl boss fight or something.. actually something rewarding.. (up to lvl 101.. or even more rewarding on higher lvls.. i would grind up all way ^^)
should get discussed.. i guess there are many ideas out there.. it just needs to be realized in some way.


i've been thinking about it harder, i honestly am having much more troubles thinking of a reasonable reward than i am of thinking of a wicked raid/boss battle, mechanics are all there, just aren't utilized, make the party move to the back row during certain attacks, casters need to focus down "sheild" adds, ect. the rewards are just hard to make reasonable, cant be 500 ee items or anything that makes 1-71 take 15 mins. im thinking xv and xvi gear lvl 75 & 80 with a new mod of some kind that only helps vs boss battles, but im really not good with the rewards side of things.
Go Back To Ladder Slasher Topic List
Prev12345Next
Add Reply New Topic New Poll