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Oct 21 2014 12:11am
Quote (Tylr @ Oct 21 2014 02:09am)
Didn't Humanity create that world?


I'm not sure what you mean. Humans are not the cause of diseases or hurricanes.
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Oct 21 2014 12:18am
Quote (Voyaging @ Oct 21 2014 02:11am)
I'm not sure what you mean. Humans are not the cause of diseases or hurricanes.


Oh fuck I need to read

I have no response.


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Oct 21 2014 12:08pm
Quote (Voyaging @ Oct 21 2014 12:29am)
What is your response to the problem of natural evil? I.e. why did God create a world filled with suffering due to disease, natural disasters, etc.?

Sorry if this was already covered, I didn't read all 55 pages :P


Ya wouldn't expect you to read anything longer than 5 pages =) I want to preface that most of this is the gospel story, which brief interruptions of my thoughts on the subject. I could be wrong, but I am trying to pull what I can from the Bible. Also not super linear but I will try to do my best.

So God created perfect world, a paradise where God and man could commune without expectation, without separation, with unhindered intimacy. But an evil snake(satan), had man do the 1 thing they ought not to, eat from the forbidden tree. By eating from the tree man basically said they would trust their own ways and not God's. So they fell and with it came consequences.
So their is no doubt that natural evil happens, but the question is where does it come from?
God's goal for us: to be reconciled to us so that he may be glorified.

In a world without natural disasters(illnesses etc.), men would need nothing. In fact, the garden of Eden was utopian they had God and didn't need to strive to produce food. They had duties, but not ones of intense suffering.
But since we are now separated if everything was perfect, no one would feel the need to come back to God. See God is perfection, He is perfect goodness. There is nothing that satisfies our souls and inner most beings like knowing and being known by God. He designed us to need him and so to give us anything that doesn't lead us to Him would be bad of him.
God's goal: get us to see our problems and turn back to him so he can fill us up and be satisfied in him so he receives glory.

So the Bible talks about God sending natural disasters in order to wake the people up. He sends hail storms to kill armies, he sends plagues to show judgement, etc. But this isn't always consistent, because sometimes he gives people over to their evil ways and doesn't judge them here on Earth(all will be judged in heaven).


So now you may ask how can He good if he slaughters millions of innocent people.
I want to preface with Romans 5:8 "But God demonstrates His love for us, that while we were sinners, Christ died for us." God loves everyone! Plain and simple from the atheist to the muslim extremist, to the missionary his love is the same. But receiving that love is different in there lives.
So now we need to look at the word innocent. "For ALL have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God." (Rom 3:23) and "For the wages of sin is DEATH" (Rom 6:23) Furthermore the Bible says to break any part of the law is like breaking all of it and Jesus expanded that even if a lustful thought is lingered on that it is like adultery. . AKA everyone deserves death...both literally and spiritually.

Another interesting verse below, explaining that disasters do not equal judgment for evil deeds.
Luke 13 " There were some present at that very time who told him about the Galileans whose blood Pilate had mingled with their sacrifices. 2 And he answered them, “Do you think that these Galileans were worse sinners than all the other Galileans, because they suffered in this way? 3 No, I tell you; but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish. 4 Or those eighteen on whom the tower in Siloam fell and killed them: do you think that they were worse offenders than all the others who lived in Jerusalem? 5 No, I tell you; but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.”

So God before the universe lovingly provided a way to trade off judgement for freedom. He is trying to bring people to himself. I am sure many of my friends would agree with this comment: I would rather me and my friends die right now in a tragedy to see 1 person come to Christ and have their eternity changed.

So to wrap up. God made a perfect world with people who required him. Man decided he didn't want God, sinned, and evil entered the world. God is trying to meet the needs of man, but first he has to get their attention and draw them to himself.

PS: Biblically natural disasters are sent by God, but I can't try to explain why tragedies like Katrina happen. I still wrestle with events, but I stand on the truth that God is good all the time.
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Oct 25 2014 10:31pm
and back from med school interview :)
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Oct 25 2014 10:56pm
Quote (wofire @ Oct 25 2014 10:31pm)
and back from med school interview :)


Hope you had better thought answers than posted above...
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Oct 26 2014 03:15am
Quote (Thor123422 @ Oct 26 2014 12:56am)
Hope you had better thought answers than posted above...


Pretty rude considering he is seemingly being quite nice
Maybe you should point out things you dislike about his answer instead, so he can respond and explain?
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Oct 26 2014 09:43am
so what do you make of them muslims, hindus and buddhists
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Oct 26 2014 10:48am
Quote (duffman316 @ 26 Oct 2014 10:43)
so what do you make of them muslims, hindus and buddhists



why they were'n born to the wrong mammy and pappy s'all
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Oct 26 2014 10:54am
If you were an angel tasked with explaining the metaphysical truth of the universe to a bunch of goat herders would you speak of the first single amoeba finally splitting creating a second out of itself, or would you use a nice metaphor like there was a man, he was lonely, and out of him became woman? Which would be easier to understand for simple folk? Highly intelligent people would hear this, and not take it literally, because they're able to think in abstract terms. Most people, especially people living during such superstitious and fantastic times, would take it literally. Some people still take it literally, and for many reasons that aren't exactly transparent.
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Oct 27 2014 10:43pm
Quote (duffman316 @ Oct 26 2014 10:43am)
so what do you make of them muslims, hindus and buddhists


I think God loves them as much as Christians.
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